Digest Archive vol 1 Issue 260
From: owner-champ-l-digest@sysabend.org
Sent: Friday, April 02, 1999 3:16 PM
To: champ-l-digest@sysabend.org
Subject: champ-l-digest V1 #260
champ-l-digest Friday, April 2 1999 Volume 01 : Number 260
In this issue:
Re: HOUSE RULE: Super Speedy Skills
Re: HOUSE RULE: Super Speedy Skills
Re: HOUSE RULE: Super Speedy Skills
Re: HOUSE RULE: Super Speedy Skills
Re: HOUSE RULE: Super Speedy Skills
Re: HOUSE RULE: Super Speedy Skills
Re: HOUSE RULE: Super Speedy Skills
Re: HOUSE RULE: Super Speedy Skills
Re: Slippery Situations
Re: HOUSE RULE: Super Speedy Skills
Re: [Trigger and Personal Immunity]
Re: Entangle Question (oh, Mr. Long?)
RE: Entangle Question (oh, Mr. Long?)
subscribe
Re: superpatriots and other madmen
Re: superpatriots and other madmen
Re: superpatriots and other madmen
Re: superpatriots and other madmen
Ocean Currents of Thalassos
Battle-light adventures?
Re: [Trigger and Personal Immunity]
Re: Battle-light adventures?
Re: HOUSE RULE: Super Speedy Skills
Converting D&D spells to HERO
Re: Converting D&D spells to HERO
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 17:25:58 -0800
From: "James Jandebeur" <james@javaman.to>
Subject: Re: HOUSE RULE: Super Speedy Skills
> A speedster cannot do research faster than a normal. Genetic material
only
> reproduces so fast. When would someone speed up a philosophical decision?
> Please give me an example of a Philosophical/Intellectual/Research item
> which would benefit from faster physical movement.
Comic book speedsters are frequently, however, presented as being faster
thinkers than ordinary human beings. Quicksilver once learned to play the
piano, at least for one song, by trial and error within minutes of starting
(with lots of noise during those minutes). The Flash defeats opponents all
the time by the simply thinking faster than they do (and he's supposed to be
fairly smart to begin with, in most incarnations).
And the Flash in his current form can impart his speed into things, so he
actually COULD do genetic research faster (if he had such fine control), but
that's an exception that normally won't come up.
This is the type of thing that is usually being discussed when this topic
comes up, at least in my experience, not merely the aspect of physical
movement being sped up but everything (oddly, not aging) sped up.
JAJ, GP
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 20:54:56 -0500
From: Joe Mucchiello <why@superlink.net>
Subject: Re: HOUSE RULE: Super Speedy Skills
At 05:25 PM 4/1/99 -0800, James Jandebeur wrote:
>> A speedster cannot do research faster than a normal. Genetic material
>only
>> reproduces so fast. When would someone speed up a philosophical decision?
>> Please give me an example of a Philosophical/Intellectual/Research item
>> which would benefit from faster physical movement.
>
>Comic book speedsters are frequently, however, presented as being faster
>thinkers than ordinary human beings. Quicksilver once learned to play the
>piano, at least for one song, by trial and error within minutes of starting
>(with lots of noise during those minutes). The Flash defeats opponents all
>the time by the simply thinking faster than they do (and he's supposed to be
>fairly smart to begin with, in most incarnations).
Playing the piano is physical. Intellectual skills should never REQUIRE 1
hour or 1 day to accomplish. Inspiration is always a 0 phase action.
Joe
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 21:03:40 -0500
From: Joe Mucchiello <why@superlink.net>
Subject: Re: HOUSE RULE: Super Speedy Skills
At 04:38 PM 4/1/99 -0800, Filksinger wrote:
>From: Joe Mucchiello <why@superlink.net>
>> At 02:10 PM 4/1/99 -0800, Filksinger wrote:
>> >If it is a simple to fix problem that he diagnosed as difficult, it makes
>> >him look stupid, incompetent, and/or ridiculously lucky.
>> >
>> >Additionally, many skills can't be hand-waved in this fashion. If I give
>a
>> >highly skilled mechanic the _parts_, and tell him, "I want a car in 20
>> >minutes", there exists a distinct possibility that he can do it by making
>a
>> >lucky roll. This is just plain silly.
>>
>> See the A-Team.
>
>No. I refuse. I will tolerate comic books, but not _that_.:)
MacGuyver?
>>As I said, I'm looking at the rules from a cinematic
>> viewpoint.
>
>But that only applies to one type of campaign. Comic book campaigns are
>often _not_ cinematic, but require superspeed rules. Same goes for fantasy.
Comics are always cinematic. Unless you are talking about golf anime.
Even Archie comics are cinematic.
>>Building a car from scratch is not important to the story and
>> thus the super-mechanic would not bother doing it as fast as possible.
>
>It could easily become _vital_ to the story. Heroes are supposed to be
>trapped with monster who only comes out at night. Heroes attempt simple plan
>that only works with the use of the car. Heroes discover that someone has
>taken their car apart to trap them. Master mechanic makes his roll by 8, and
>finishes a complete car in 20 minutes, from spare parts. Character's plan,
>which only required transportation to work, is now so easy that monster
>isn't even a threat.
And you don't like the A-Team? :-) As someone pointed out, if you as GM
don't think it's likely, put negatives on the roll. I would even let the
speed 3 brick (with Mohawk) with Mechanics succeed in 20 minutes. And,
hey, how contrived is that example? Why did they take the car apart when
they could have flattened it? No one can repair a flattened car.
>> Please agree to disagree.
>
>Certainly.
>
>I have no objection to this rule in the type of campaign you describe.
>However, HERO already has a rule for the type of campaign you describe. Make
>a roll by -10, and you can do virtually impossible things.
>
>Unfortunately, most games are not of the sort where the Extraordinary Skill
>rules are fitting. Nor do they readily fit super powers and magic spells.
>Neither, unfortunately, do yours.
But in those games where it is impossible BY DEFINITION no one would have a
power which made it possible.
>Superhumans do what is not "physically possible" all the time. If I used
>your rules in a superhero campaign, and the expert mechanic couldn't fix the
>car in one minute, because it is beyond human capabilities, but the
>speedster could, even though he doesn't have nearly as much mechanic skill,
>just by making a good roll and having "SFX:speedster", the master mechanic's
>player would scream, and with cause. The speedster would routinely be able
>to do things he couldn't, even if his skill were greater.
If he is fast enough, he can combine every single part in every combination
until he gets it right in a phase. If he's fast enough. And master
mechanic should realize that he will get it done without needing to break
the sound barrier. I've never had a game where Mechanic skill came up in a
critical situation. I try to put the important parts of the game on the
players being clever rather on them making a good die roll.
>But he doesn't have to. You can finish walls, including windows, and even
>ceilings if you know what you are doing, without even using mortar. The
>Incas never had mortar. If I have a 15- with Stonemason, and I decide to
>build a stone house, then, even if it supposed to take a year, I can, by
>rolling a 8-, finish during a lunch break from my real job.
But in a realistic game, it would not be up to code. If a player in my
game said he was going to try that, he better start laughing soon. Silly
is just silly.
>How quickly you can do things like this can easily be vital to a game.
>Suppose two people are dying, and only one player has the skill to save
>them? The villians are getting away, and you are busy bandaging the wounded.
>Various others.
In my games, the speedster usually doesn't have paramedic. He picks up the
dying person, that the guy with paramedic can't get to, and speeds over to
a hospital. Meanwhile, the rest of the party is after the villains. My
players always split up.
>Keep in mind that, at this level, I am only advocating 1 more point. A
>character who was 125 times faster than normal as a Mechanic, for example,
>would only cost 3 pts more my way than yours.
But no one would by multiple levels in a single skill. A speedster is
going to multiple levels for all skills. I object to that costing 10 per
instead of 5 per.
>> >Superspeed repairs.
>>
>> What is the purpose behind the repairs? If the story hinges on it then
>> sure, anyone can put a house together in a minute.
>
>1. I wouldn't allow that in any but the silliest games.
anyone = any speedster.
>2. Who said anything about the story hingeing on it? Stories often don't
>hinge on all kinds of abilities that cost a lot more than 2 pts. Few stories
>actually hinge on the hero's Life Support, or Flight, or quite a few other
>powers, and they cost a lot more than what I am suggesting.
Then who cares how long it take to do. (Which was my point.) No one is
going to try to build a house in a minute under pressure. Flight often
affects every battle that takes place. Life Support stops many limited
powers. Fixing a carborator doesn't come up.
>> >Superspeed "catch the falling people".
>>
>> That's a movement power, not a skill. Some kind of bizarre move by.
>
>Not necessarily. If a character didn't have "Autofire grab", then, even if
>he had the movement power, he couldn't do it. Since "autofire grab" is, for
>the most part, a rather silly power ("I grab all 5 Viper agents at once!"
>"Do you have stretching?" "No." "Then you grabbed five, but released 3 to
>get the last 2."), it is likely that the character won't have it.
And so you've proven that a speedster cannot catch 5 falling people with
skill levels? What was the point of the "catch falling people"
>> >Superspeed "reforge the passport papers".
>>
>> Another "how often" problem. If the character is a speedster, this is
>> worth hand-waving. Forcing him to pay 30 points for super-forgery is
>silly.
>
>Why would it have to be 30 pts? For "Able to forge a document that should
>take 5 hours in 1 minute", using your suggestion, would cost 8 pts. With
>mine, it would cost 12.
That assumes you only bought fast forgery. We were discussing a generic
speedster originally. At your costs, that's 30.
>And, in a great many games (espianage games spring to mind), the ability to
>forge documents in minutes instead of hours would be a very useful ability.
And unrealistic. Should I say cinematic? If you allow people to take the
power which makes it faster, why not just give them a penalty for taking
less time down the time chart? What is the difference? (I think that's
what I've been arguing all this time.) Who would know at character
creation that being able to forge documents fast is a good idea? Why not
just make use of skill penalties?
>> >The ability to handle all 6 positions on the bridge
>> >when the ship is in danger at once, while doing repairs on the
>> >communications console and helm controls. Etc. Etc. Etc.
>>
>> Doing 6 things at once is only one level down the time chart.
>
>Two, since one would only allow for doing 5 things at once, and he wouldn't
>have time to get from position to position on the bridge. Besides, if all he
>needed was one level down the chart, then the power only cost 10 pts, or 5
>if it is a +1 time level for ship use skills.
One allows 5 things and two allows 25 things and you'd force 6 things into
the two slot? It's not like the time chart is perfectly linear.
>> >Frankly, the ability to do _anything non-combat and non-movement_ at 125
>> >times normal speed for 30 pts seems more than fair to me.
>>
>> I still say it is too expensive. It's color.
>
>In every campaign I have used it, it has been much more than color. A
>general Time bonus rapidly becomes one of the most used Powers in the game.
>Quite useful. Only the fact that it doesn't apply to movement or combat
>keeps it from being worth even more.
>
>> Personally, I just use
>> Change Environment. It is good enough.
>
>1. Can't be used for changing the character. A character with this power
>could not get dressed super fast, or put on make-up, or put on bandages and
>stop his own bleeding.
A speedster who doesn't have instant change? Bandaging bleeding takes a
phase IIRC.
>2. Change Environment, over an area, with variable effect to cover all
>things that could be done by superspeed, is more expensive than your method.
But it's in the rules.
>3. Many things done with such a power should be Transforms, not Change
>Environment. This boosts the cost even more.
Strickly yes.
>> I don't know of any rule which
>> says that you cannot use more than one skill per phase.
>
>If you told me, "In this phase, my character will use Paramedics on all 5
>injured people", I'd laugh in your face. And if you tried to buy the
>ability, I'd point out that, under the present rules, it cannot be bought,
>except by an expensive Transform.
Yes, but you would laugh because I cannot reach 5 people at a time. The
speedster's paramedic special effect would make it possible.
Joe
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 17:47:58 -0800 (PST)
From: shaw@caprica.com (Wayne Shaw)
Subject: Re: HOUSE RULE: Super Speedy Skills
>>Comic book speedsters are frequently, however, presented as being faster
>>thinkers than ordinary human beings. Quicksilver once learned to play the
>>piano, at least for one song, by trial and error within minutes of starting
>>(with lots of noise during those minutes). The Flash defeats opponents all
>>the time by the simply thinking faster than they do (and he's supposed to be
>>fairly smart to begin with, in most incarnations).
>
>Playing the piano is physical. Intellectual skills should never REQUIRE 1
>hour or 1 day to accomplish. Inspiration is always a 0 phase action.
Reasoning out the consequences at details is not, however. Even intuitive
geniuses usually have to do some gruntwork.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 21:13:45 -0500 (EST)
From: Jason Sullivan <ravanos@NJCU.edu>
Subject: Re: HOUSE RULE: Super Speedy Skills
> A speedster cannot do research faster than a normal. Genetic material only
> reproduces so fast. When would someone speed up a philosophical decision?
> Please give me an example of a Philosophical/Intellectual/Research item
> which would benefit from faster physical movement.
The Flash can do research faster than normal.
In fact, if the Flash wanted to, he could read through all the
files in a given building, think about what he read, compose a eloquent
paper based on what he had read, and check for errors... in a few minutes.
There's your research and intellectual.
Now, here's a non-super speed SFX for the proposed Hyper Skills.
Mr. Fantastic has Hyper Invention. Not only is he smarter than
your average bear, but he can also create new technologies on the spot,
often in record time.
As for creative... It takes time to work on pieces of art.
Conceptualization, referencing in one's own mind, self correction, until
the "vision" is reached... more over, it requires a skill roll.
And there's a rift... some people can be more spontaneous and
create art quicker, although they may not be better artists technically
than their slower counterparts, even if given equivalent time to finish.
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 01 Apr 1999 22:08:53 -0600
From: "Michael (Damon) & Peni Griffin" <griffin@txdirect.net>
Subject: Re: HOUSE RULE: Super Speedy Skills
Excuse me butting in. I haven't been following this thread, and have
deleted most of the messages unread, but I ran across this in "Murphy's
Rules" today and it seemed kind of appropriate to the few parts of the
discussion I've seen:
"In RTG's "Castle Falkenstein" a character with extraordinary Tinkering
ability can finish inventing a new chemical formula sixteen weeks BEFORE he
started."
Perhaps once the "speedy skills" house rule is ironed out, it should be
sent to RTG for their consideration as well. :)
Damon
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 22:13:30 -0800
From: "James Jandebeur" <james@javaman.to>
Subject: Re: HOUSE RULE: Super Speedy Skills
> "In RTG's "Castle Falkenstein" a character with extraordinary Tinkering
> ability can finish inventing a new chemical formula sixteen weeks BEFORE
he
> started."
heh heh heh.
Sorry, I had to.
JAJ, GP
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 1 Apr 1999 22:08:55 -0800
From: "James Jandebeur" <james@javaman.to>
Subject: Re: HOUSE RULE: Super Speedy Skills
> Playing the piano is physical. Intellectual skills should never REQUIRE 1
> hour or 1 day to accomplish. Inspiration is always a 0 phase action.
Playing the piano is both, really. But I like your interpretation of
intellectual skills taking (potentially) very little time, though that isn't
the norm.
JAJ, GP
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 1999 19:38:11 -0800
From: Rick Holding <rholding@actonline.com.au>
Subject: Re: Slippery Situations
Derek Hiemforth wrote:
>
> At 7:33 AM -0800 3/31/99, Jason Sullivan wrote:
> > I need to work on a power that will impair a hero's abaility to
> >pick up and manipulate objects (DEX drain?).
> >
> > I also need to have an appropiate flaw to negate the power, which
> >is very common and common sense. An absorbant material, like clay dust,
> >can absorb it, soap and water can dilute it, and it can eventually be
> >wiped off. It evaporates over time, as well.
>
> This may sound like a silly way to do it, and there may well be better
> ones, but what about Desolid? (The fact that you defined a way to cancel
> the effect is what made me think of it.) Perhaps Desolid Usable Against
> Other in an Area, with the Limitations that it provides no immunity to
> attack and doesn't allow passing through things. The special effect
> would be that characters simply couldn't get a hold on anything unless
> they had the effect that the Desolid didn't work against (dust, soap
> and water, etc.)
Actually, on the face of it this is better than most things I've seen
about the subject. However, it still has a few problems. Desolid wont
let you interact with the reql world. Being covered in super-oil
doesn't stop you from punch things, although it will stop you from
holding things. It wont stop you from firing your built in energy
blasts at anybody, which desolid would. Desolid with the limitation of
only to stop holding or carrying things or "interacting" with the ground
to stop the walking or running could work.
I'll chicken out at the point of deciding HOW much of a limitation this
would be.
- --
Rick Holding
If only "common sense" was just a bit more common...
or if you prefer... You call this logic ?
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 1999 19:59:19 -0800
From: Rick Holding <rholding@actonline.com.au>
Subject: Re: HOUSE RULE: Super Speedy Skills
You know, much of the arguments about this can be desolved by saying
that it takes 5 hours to fix the car with a speed of two (base human
norm). Marvin the Speedster has a speed of 8. He can do it in an hour
15. Simple.
- --
Rick Holding
If only "common sense" was just a bit more common...
or if you prefer... You call this logic ?
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 1999 20:05:57 -0800
From: Rick Holding <rholding@actonline.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Trigger and Personal Immunity]
geoff heald wrote:
>
> At 07:13 PM 3/31/99 -0500, you wrote:
> >At 7:50 PM -0500 3/30/99, ANTHONY VARGAS wrote:
> >>Well, triggered powers don't generally act like free detects, but, I think
> >>in most genres, the person who casts a spell has a certain attachment to
> >>it, so it wouldn't be unreasonable. It depends on how you think of magick.
> >
> > How would it be acting as a free detect?
> >
>
> I have a power and cast it on a hex with the trigger: Only when a non-party
> member enters that hex. I can now sleep comfortably because I know if
> anyone comes through that door (and enters the hex inside it) a nice loud
> Energy Blast will go off and wake me up (or draw my attention or whatever).
> Might also work if I said Trigger:Only when an Invisible creature enters
> the hex.
Ah, master. It is my sad duty to report that you are DEAD. Your wards
did not detect the invisible assassin which would have been hidden from
your sight had you been there. I await your next incarnation.
- --
Rick Holding
If only "common sense" was just a bit more common...
or if you prefer... You call this logic ?
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 1999 20:12:10 -0800
From: Rick Holding <rholding@actonline.com.au>
Subject: Re: Entangle Question (oh, Mr. Long?)
Bob Greenwade wrote:
>
> At 01:17 PM 4/1/1999 -0800, David W. Salmon wrote:
> >You buy the area effect as "Selective". First you define the area, then roll
> >to hit the area (or hex). Then you roll to hit whichever targets you would
> >like which are in that area. The default for area effect is non-selective.
> >Buying Selective increases the advantage cost.
>
> This doesn't really answer the question, so I'll be a little more specific:
> How (short of a Limited Advantage, which I'm trying to avoid) do I
> explicitly limit then number of targts to 2, 4, 8, or 16?
I think, to be blunt, you can't. You could define the area effect to
"any shape" version, number of hexes to taste, with extra time, one turn
to allow you to hook everybody up.
- --
Rick Holding
If only "common sense" was just a bit more common...
or if you prefer... You call this logic ?
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 1999 07:16:59 -0800
From: "David W. Salmon" <dwsalmon@earthlink.net>
Subject: RE: Entangle Question (oh, Mr. Long?)
Can you just say that only one person would be allowed to be entangled per
hex ?? 2 per hex ?? staying with the area effect, any area, selective,
sticky entangle ... ?
- -----Original Message-----
From: owner-champ-l@sysabend.org [mailto:owner-champ-l@sysabend.org]On
Behalf Of Rick Holding
Sent: Friday, April 02, 1999 8:12 PM
To: champ-l@sysabend.org
Subject: Re: Entangle Question (oh, Mr. Long?)
Bob Greenwade wrote:
>
> At 01:17 PM 4/1/1999 -0800, David W. Salmon wrote:
> >You buy the area effect as "Selective". First you define the area, then
roll
> >to hit the area (or hex). Then you roll to hit whichever targets you
would
> >like which are in that area. The default for area effect is
non-selective.
> >Buying Selective increases the advantage cost.
>
> This doesn't really answer the question, so I'll be a little more
specific:
> How (short of a Limited Advantage, which I'm trying to avoid) do I
> explicitly limit then number of targts to 2, 4, 8, or 16?
I think, to be blunt, you can't. You could define the area effect to
"any shape" version, number of hexes to taste, with extra time, one turn
to allow you to hook everybody up.
- --
Rick Holding
If only "common sense" was just a bit more common...
or if you prefer... You call this logic ?
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 1999 08:10:51 -0800 (PST)
From: Dennis C Hwang <dchwang@itsa.ucsf.edu>
Subject: subscribe
subscribe hero-l
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 1999 09:25:35 -0800 (PST)
From: "Steven J. Owens" <puff@netcom.com>
Subject: Re: superpatriots and other madmen
Bill Svitavsky writes:
> All of this suggests a number of possibilities for patriotic heroes:
> conservative patriots who stand for what they see as their nation's
> tradtitional values, liberal patriots who see themselves as participating
> in a progression of their nation's ideals, middle-of-the-road patriots who
> see their nation's strength in the diversity of its viewpoints, and even
> apolitical patriots whose extreme nationalism leads them to believe in
> their country, regardless of what its politics might be.
Not that I ever collected Captain America, but my favorite
characterization of him worked out to a combination of three elements:
the essence of macho (particularly since he has no sperpowers, just
the ultimate perfection of the human body and spirit), experience and
leadership, and finally the core of the american ideals - the ideas of
diversity, fairness, freedom, compassion, self-reliance, etc. Most
americans, I think, agree that these are worthy ideals, but disagree
on how to achieve them, on issues of priority, and on issues of
precedence. That's the difference between a patriotic hero and a
politician :-).
A patriotic hero or superhero, just like any superhero, is a sort
of anthropomorphic personification of an idea - a myth. The
difference is that a patriotic hero is the anthropomorphic
personification of the idea(s) that is the core of a nation's beliefs.
He or she isn't supposed to stand for a particular political agenda,
but for the uniting beliefs that bind all of the body politic in
question together.
Specifically relevant to Captain America, I think most americans
don't realize how weird our culture is, compared to the rest of the
world and history. Sometimes that weirdness is bad, dangerous, or
just plain embarrassing (the ugly american being the classic exaple),
at other times, other cultures regard us as somewhat childish (not
that I agree that it's necessarily a bad thing). But a lot of the
time (in my opinion, of course) it turns out to be something quite
special.
Steven J. Owens
puff@netcom.com
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 1999 12:39:39 -0500
From: "Scott C. Nolan" <nolan@erols.com>
Subject: Re: superpatriots and other madmen
- --=====================_51838880==_.ALT
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
At 09:25 AM 4/2/99 -0800, Steven J. Owens wrote:
> Specifically relevant to Captain America, I think most americans
>don't realize how weird our culture is, compared to the rest of the
>world and history. Sometimes that weirdness is bad, dangerous, or
>just plain embarrassing (the ugly american being the classic exaple),
>at other times, other cultures regard us as somewhat childish (not
>that I agree that it's necessarily a bad thing). But a lot of the
>time (in my opinion, of course) it turns out to be something quite
>special.
That really is unbelievable insulting. The 'weirdest' thing about
American culture is that we've allowed the press and radicals
and Euro-whiners to convince the common man that we should
aplogize for American culture.
The ugly american is the perfect example of the nihilisitic sixties
crap that we've been force-fed for too long. I don't want to participate
in a political discussion, so I'll stop now, but this is something that
just can't be constantly passed by.
- --=====================_51838880==_.ALT
Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"
<html>
<font size=3>At 09:25 AM 4/2/99 -0800, Steven J. Owens wrote:<br>
> Specifically relevant to Captain America, I
think most americans<br>
>don't realize how weird our culture is, compared to the rest of
the<br>
>world and history. Sometimes that weirdness is bad, dangerous,
or<br>
>just plain embarrassing (the ugly american being the classic
exaple),<br>
>at other times, other cultures regard us as somewhat childish
(not<br>
>that I agree that it's necessarily a bad thing). But a lot of
the<br>
>time (in my opinion, of course) it turns out to be something
quite<br>
>special.<br>
<br>
That really is unbelievable insulting. The 'weirdest' thing
about<br>
American culture is that we've allowed the press and radicals <br>
and Euro-whiners to convince the common man that we should<br>
aplogize for American culture.<br>
<br>
The ugly american is the perfect example of the nihilisitic sixties
<br>
crap that we've been force-fed for too long. I don't want to participate
<br>
in a political discussion, so I'll stop now, but this is something
that<br>
just can't be constantly passed by.</font><br>
</html>
- --=====================_51838880==_.ALT--
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 1999 12:47:48 -0500 (EST)
From: Jason Sullivan <ravanos@NJCU.edu>
Subject: Re: superpatriots and other madmen
On Fri, 2 Apr 1999, Scott C. Nolan wrote:
> That really is unbelievable insulting. The 'weirdest' thing about
> American culture is that we've allowed the press and radicals
> and Euro-whiners to convince the common man that we should
> aplogize for American culture.
Should I take insult to the "Euro-whiner" comment? :)
> The ugly american is the perfect example of the nihilisitic sixties
> crap that we've been force-fed for too long. I don't want to participate
> in a political discussion, so I'll stop now, but this is something that
> just can't be constantly passed by.
I think what's 'ugly' about America isn't specifically American.
Racism, sexism, and discrimination. Homeless, poverty, and rampant
disease. Political scandal, organized crime, and extremist groups.
I don't think being American is the problem.
I think it just boils down to ignorance.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 1999 12:55:58 -0500
From: "Scott C. Nolan" <nolan@erols.com>
Subject: Re: superpatriots and other madmen
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>> That really is unbelievable insulting. The 'weirdest' thing about
>> American culture is that we've allowed the press and radicals
>> and Euro-whiners to convince the common man that we should
>> aplogize for American culture.
>
> Should I take insult to the "Euro-whiner" comment? :)
Not intended to take in the whole of Europe. Just the counterparts to
American nihilists.
>> The ugly american is the perfect example of the nihilisitic sixties
>> crap that we've been force-fed for too long. I don't want to participate
>> in a political discussion, so I'll stop now, but this is something that
>> just can't be constantly passed by.
>
> I think what's 'ugly' about America isn't specifically American.
>Racism, sexism, and discrimination. Homeless, poverty, and rampant
>disease. Political scandal, organized crime, and extremist groups.
>
> I don't think being American is the problem.
>
> I think it just boils down to ignorance.
"The Ugly American" was a novel about how rude and unthinking
Americans are in foreign lands.
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<html>
<font size=3>>> That really is unbelievable insulting. The
'weirdest' thing about<br>
>> American culture is that we've allowed the press and radicals
<br>
>> and Euro-whiners to convince the common man that we should<br>
>> aplogize for American culture.<br>
><br>
><x-tab> </x-tab>Should I
take insult to the "Euro-whiner" comment? :)<br>
<br>
Not intended to take in the whole of Europe. Just the counterparts
to<br>
American nihilists. <br>
<br>
>> The ugly american is the perfect example of the nihilisitic
sixties <br>
>> crap that we've been force-fed for too long. I don't want to
participate <br>
>> in a political discussion, so I'll stop now, but this is
something that<br>
>> just can't be constantly passed by.<br>
><br>
><x-tab> </x-tab>I think
what's 'ugly' about America isn't specifically American.<br>
>Racism, sexism, and discrimination. Homeless, poverty, and
rampant<br>
>disease. Political scandal, organized crime, and extremist
groups.<br>
><br>
><x-tab> </x-tab>I don't
think being American is the problem.<br>
><x-tab> </x-tab><br>
><x-tab> </x-tab>I think it
just boils down to ignorance.<br>
<br>
"The Ugly American" was a novel about how rude and unthinking
<br>
Americans are in foreign lands.<br>
</font><br>
</html>
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------------------------------
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 1999 12:15:17 -0600
From: "Guy Hoyle" <ghoyle1@airmail.net>
Subject: Ocean Currents of Thalassos
I have been trying to work on a climatic scheme for my world Thalassos (
http://members.xoom.com/tethysguy/thalassos.htm ), and I've been struggling
with ocean currents. Thalassos is spherical, but it's a hollow world in a
geocentric system; therefore, tides, ocean currents, and climate are all
magical, not "natural" as they are in our world. Keeping that in mind, I
don't want to have Thalassos' ocean currents to be just a reflection of
Earth's currents (if that makes any sense).
Therefore, I am trying to devise a new model about how Thalassos' oceans DO
work, and that's where I'm running into trouble. I think that the "source"
of these currents are at the centers of Thalassos' mighty oceans. Various
cultures regard these sources as deities, major spirits, manifestations of
elemental force, etc., depending on their interpretations of these things.
Regardless of their origins, I see these forces waxing and waning in
strength depending on the seasons and other magical influences. Powerful
currents sweep out from them, spiralling out and becoming weaker and more
diffuse. (This makes the sailing less treacherous near the shorelines, of
course, which makes coastal sailing far easier than transoceanic voyages,
which suits me).
However, sketching out this process has been maddening, and I find myself
to be stymied right now, which means that I can't go much farther on my
climate model of Thalassos, which sort of impacts everything else. Any
suggestions would be very much appreciated.
Guy
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 1999 13:32:26 -0500
From: David Stallard <DBStallard@compuserve.com>
Subject: Battle-light adventures?
One of my players seems to think that you can't have a Champions adventur=
e
without tons of combat. While I enjoy the combat (and may be to blame fo=
r
his impression), I want to show him that there can be a lot more to it th=
an
fighting...it might also get him to think a little deeper about his
character than just what he can do in combat.
Anyway, are there any published adventures that are light on the combat a=
nd
worthy enough to consider? Off the top of my head, the only possibility =
I
can come up with is the murder mystery adventure in Champions Presents #2=
. =
I had been planning to run that one eventually, but I think this player h=
as
convinced me that it might need to happen as soon as our current adventur=
e
ends (an invasion by Mechanon and his robot army, which has had quite a b=
it
of combat so far).
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 1999 13:38:47 -0500
From: Mathieu Roy <matroy@abacom.com>
Subject: Re: [Trigger and Personal Immunity]
Rick Holding wrote:
> geoff heald wrote:
> > I have a power and cast it on a hex with the trigger: Only when a non-party
> > member enters that hex. I can now sleep comfortably because I know if
> > anyone comes through that door (and enters the hex inside it) a nice loud
> > Energy Blast will go off and wake me up (or draw my attention or whatever).
> > Might also work if I said Trigger:Only when an Invisible creature enters
> > the hex.
>
> Ah, master. It is my sad duty to report that you are DEAD. Your wards
> did not detect the invisible assassin which would have been hidden from
> your sight had you been there. I await your next incarnation.
Here's a thought. The ward might be able to react to *touch* -- much like a
pressure plate -- and notice that it cannot see the being that it touches --
therefore that an invisible creature has entered the hex. The caster, were he in
the hex in question, could certainly get the same input and make the same
deduction. Of course, a flying assassin would be able to bypass the ward entirely.
Mathieu
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 1999 14:14:05 -0500
From: Glen Sprigg <borealis@cois.on.ca>
Subject: Re: Battle-light adventures?
>Anyway, are there any published adventures that are light on the combat and
>worthy enough to consider? Off the top of my head, the only possibility I
>can come up with is the murder mystery adventure in Champions Presents #2.
>I had been planning to run that one eventually, but I think this player has
>convinced me that it might need to happen as soon as our current adventure
>ends (an invasion by Mechanon and his robot army, which has had quite a bit
>of combat so far).
>
Look at some of the adventure outlines in Classic Organizations; one that
sticks out is the one where the PCs have to stop a Russian sub from doing a
reverse Red October thing (actually nuking New York rather than defecting).
Glen
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 1999 11:15:14 -0800
From: "Filksinger" <filkhero@usa.net>
Subject: Re: HOUSE RULE: Super Speedy Skills
From: Joe Mucchiello <why@superlink.net>
> At 05:25 PM 4/1/99 -0800, James Jandebeur wrote:
> Playing the piano is physical. Intellectual skills should never REQUIRE 1
> hour or 1 day to accomplish. Inspiration is always a 0 phase action.
You've never done a complex equation, or worked out a long chain of
reasoning? Try doing 5th order quadratic equations as 0 phase actions, or
analyze the latest "proof" of Fermat's Last Theorem.
Filksinger
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 2 Apr 1999 14:08:47 -0600 (CST)
From: "Dr. Nuncheon" <jeffj@io.com>
Subject: Converting D&D spells to HERO
Some of them are easy. Some are ponderous. Here's one that I was having
trouble thinking of a way to do:
Knock. If I remember the spell right, it attempted to open any
door, whether said door was closed, locked physically, or sealed
magically.
So...how might it work? Here are some ideas that I came up with, along
with their flaws:
TK (with fine manipulation) - it would require time and (presumably)
Lockpicking skill, whereas the spell ought to be instantaneous.
Dispel - Works fine for a magic lock, but how do you write up a normal
lock? What power would it be?
Transform - I guess you could Transform a closed door to an open one -
it's a bit wonky for use on magical spells, though - unless maybe part of
the 'Wizard Lock' spell was Power Defense.
Any ideas?
J
Hostes aliengeni me abduxerent. Jeff Johnston - jeffj@io.com
Qui annus est? http://www.io.com/~jeffj
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 02 Apr 1999 15:15:41 -0500
From: "Scott C. Nolan" <nolan@erols.com>
Subject: Re: Converting D&D spells to HERO
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At 02:08 PM 4/2/99 -0600, Dr. Nuncheon wrote:
>
>Some of them are easy. Some are ponderous. Here's one that I was having
>trouble thinking of a way to do:
>
>Knock. If I remember the spell right, it attempted to open any
>door, whether said door was closed, locked physically, or sealed
>magically.
>
>So...how might it work? Here are some ideas that I came up with, along
>with their flaws:
>
>TK (with fine manipulation) - it would require time and (presumably)
>Lockpicking skill, whereas the spell ought to be instantaneous.
>
>Dispel - Works fine for a magic lock, but how do you write up a normal
>lock? What power would it be?
>
>Transform - I guess you could Transform a closed door to an open one -
>it's a bit wonky for use on magical spells, though - unless maybe part of
>the 'Wizard Lock' spell was Power Defense.
I've translated every AD&D spell in the Wizard's Spell Compendiums
(about 1000 spells). Writing them up is taking longer. See my
website at: http://www.erols.com/nolan/hero/hero.htm and follow the
"Theeurth" link.
Here's how I did "Knock":
Multipower
1) 20 STR TK, Fine Manipulation; Indirect; Only to lock or unlock door,
shackles
welds or chains; up to two functions; not v. portcullises
2) 15d6 Supress v. Wizard Lock spell
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<html>
<font size=3>At 02:08 PM 4/2/99 -0600, Dr. Nuncheon wrote:<br>
><br>
>Some of them are easy. Some are ponderous. Here's one
that I was having<br>
>trouble thinking of a way to do:<br>
><br>
>Knock. If I remember the spell right, it attempted to open
any<br>
>door, whether said door was closed, locked physically, or
sealed<br>
>magically.<br>
><br>
>So...how might it work? Here are some ideas that I came up
with, along<br>
>with their flaws:<br>
><br>
>TK (with fine manipulation) - it would require time and
(presumably)<br>
>Lockpicking skill, whereas the spell ought to be instantaneous.<br>
><br>
>Dispel - Works fine for a magic lock, but how do you write up a
normal<br>
>lock? What power would it be?<br>
><br>
>Transform - I guess you could Transform a closed door to an open one
- -<br>
>it's a bit wonky for use on magical spells, though - unless maybe
part of<br>
>the 'Wizard Lock' spell was Power Defense.<br>
<br>
I've translated every AD&D spell in the Wizard's Spell
Compendiums<br>
(about 1000 spells). Writing them up is taking longer. See my
<br>
website at:
<a href="http://www.erols.com/nolan/hero/hero.htm" eudora="autourl">http://www.erols.com/nolan/hero/hero.htm</a>
and follow the<br>
"Theeurth" link.<br>
<br>
Here's how I did "Knock":<br>
<br>
Multipower<br>
1) 20 STR TK, Fine Manipulation; Indirect; Only to lock or unlock door, shackles<br>
welds or chains; up to two functions; not v. portcullises<br>
2) 15d6 Supress v. Wizard Lock spell</font><br>
</html>
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------------------------------
End of champ-l-digest V1 #260
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Date: Tuesday, June 29, 1999 10:10 AM