Digest Archive vol 1 Issue 393
From: owner-champ-l-digest@sysabend.org
Sent: Monday, June 14, 1999 3:58 AM
To: champ-l-digest@sysabend.org
Subject: champ-l-digest V1 #393
champ-l-digest Monday, June 14 1999 Volume 01 : Number 393
In this issue:
Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage
Re: Songs to supers...
Re: Songs to supers...
Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage
Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage
Re: Songs to supers...
Re: Swapping stats
Re: Songs to supers...
Re: Songs to supers...
Re: Songs to supers...
Re: Songs to supers...
Re: Songs to supers...
Re: Songs to supers...
Re: Songs to supers...
Re: Songs to supers...
Re: Songs to supers...
Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage
Re: Songs to supers...
Super's songs...
[LYRICS] Re: Super's songs...
Re: Songs to supers...
Re: Songs to supers...
Re: Char: Exterminators
Re: Char: Exterminators/Alien Enemies found
Re: Char: Exterminators
Re: Heroes of Styx
Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage
Re: Swapping stats
Re: Swapping stats
Re: Songs to supers...
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 15:09:53 -0700
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com>
Subject: Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage
At 10:53 AM 6/13/1999 -0400, Stainless Steel Rat wrote:
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>* Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com> on Sun, 13 Jun 1999
>| Teleportation can be used to bring others along, at no range.
>| Otherwise, what's the Extra Mass adder for?
>
>Extra Mass is for taking things or people with you when you use
>Teleportation. If you want to Teleport things other than yourself, you
>must have Usable By/Against Others, regardless of how much Extra Mass you
>might be able to move.
I'm pretty sure that the intent was that the character with the power
would be going along for the ride.
- ---
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page! [Circle of HEROS member]
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm
Merry-Go-Round Webring -- wanna join?
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/merrhome.htm
Interested in sarrusophones? Join the Sarrusophone Mailing List!
http://www.onelist.com/subscribe/Sarrusophone
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 18:29:56 -0500
From: "Michael (Damon) & Peni Griffin" <griffin@txdirect.net>
Subject: Re: Songs to supers...
At 05:44 PM 6/13/1999 -0400, Michael Surbrook wrote:
>On 13 Jun 1999, Stainless Steel Rat wrote:
>
>> Me-262 is about the Messerschmit Me-262, the first production jet=
warplane
>> in the world. It was used by Germany during World War II to bomb England
>> during the later stages of the war.
>
>I thought it was a jet fighter, not a bomber. (Germany *did* have
>dedicated jet bombers as well)
Either way, hard to see how this fits into a supers genre.
>> "The Veteran of the Psychic Wars" is one of Blue =D6yster Cult's most
>> depressing songs. It is the lament of a veteran of a series of wars in
>> which nanotechnic/psionic weapons have left him a total wreck:
>
>Co-written by Michael Moorcock (who also helped on Black Blade).
Yes, that would explain the depressing part... :)
------------------------------
Date: 13 Jun 1999 19:39:34 -0400
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net>
Subject: Re: Songs to supers...
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* Michael Surbrook <susano@dedaana.otd.com> on Sun, 13 Jun 1999
| I thought it was a jet fighter, not a bomber. (Germany *did* have
| dedicated jet bombers as well)
Actually, there were three variations of the Me-262, the A1-a Schwalbe
fighter, the A-2 Sturmvogel fighter, and the B-1a fighter-bomber. It was
the last variant that was used for bombing runs over England.
[...]
| Co-written by Michael Moorcock (who also helped on Black Blade).
And one other song, the name of which escapes me.
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Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net> \ Ingredients of Happy Fun Ball include an
Minion of Nathan - Nathan says Hi! \ unknown glowing substance which fell to
PGP Key: at a key server near you! \ Earth, presumably from outer space.
------------------------------
Date: 13 Jun 1999 19:41:20 -0400
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net>
Subject: Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage
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* Brats Incorporated <brat-inc@avalon.net> on Sun, 13 Jun 1999
| I total disagree with this one. You do not need UAO to teleport someone
| else. UAO is only used if you are teleporting someone against their
| will.
Champions Deluxe, page 87:
If a character wishes to teleport other individuals (without being
teleported himself) he must buy the Usable By Others or Usable Against
Others Power Advantages.
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Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net> \ Happy Fun Ball contains a liquid core,
Minion of Nathan - Nathan says Hi! \ which, if exposed due to rupture, should
PGP Key: at a key server near you! \ not be touched, inhaled, or looked at.
------------------------------
Date: 13 Jun 1999 19:43:00 -0400
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net>
Subject: Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage
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* shaw@caprica.com (Wayne Shaw) on Sun, 13 Jun 1999
| Okay, let's rephrase it then; you buy the Area Effect but it only works to
| bring the things within X Radius with you when you Teleport yourself. Now
| what happens?
In that case... well, if a 6D6 EB with AoE Radius hits everything in that
area with a 6D6 attack, then it stands to reason that everything in the
area of effect of this Teleportation that masses 800kg or less will go with
him.
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Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net> \ Warning: pregnant women, the elderly, and
Minion of Nathan - Nathan says Hi! \ children under 10 should avoid prolonged
PGP Key: at a key server near you! \ exposure to Happy Fun Ball.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 18:48:35 -0500
From: "Michael (Damon) & Peni Griffin" <griffin@txdirect.net>
Subject: Re: Songs to supers...
At 07:39 PM 6/13/1999 -0400, Stainless Steel Rat wrote:
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>* Michael Surbrook <susano@dedaana.otd.com> on Sun, 13 Jun 1999
>| I thought it was a jet fighter, not a bomber. (Germany *did* have
>| dedicated jet bombers as well)
>
>Actually, there were three variations of the Me-262, the A1-a Schwalbe
>fighter, the A-2 Sturmvogel fighter, and the B-1a fighter-bomber. It was
>the last variant that was used for bombing runs over England.
>
>[...]
>| Co-written by Michael Moorcock (who also helped on Black Blade).
>
>And one other song, the name of which escapes me.
I want to say "Kings of Speed" but I'm not sure.
Damon
------------------------------
Date: 13 Jun 1999 19:52:37 -0400
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net>
Subject: Re: Swapping stats
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* Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com> on Sun, 13 Jun 1999
| The problem with the logic there is that there are many more reasons in
| adventure fiction for someone to turn an attack on themselves than there
| are in real life. Leah just listed several cases, in both real life and
| fiction, where someone found a good reason (or at least what seemed to
| them like one) to do just such a thing.
But are they commonplace (normal) occourances? No, they are not, at least
not usually.
The way the Hero system works, if you come up with a clever misuse of a
power to resolve a situation, such as using Transfer on yourself to
increase your Strength so as to survive a deathtrap, the GM should let you
get away with it. But if you _always_ want to have that additional
Strength, you must pay points for it. Having Transfer, which is not
normally used on oneself, is *NOT* paying for additional Strength.
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- --
Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net> \ When not in use, Happy Fun Ball should be
Minion of Nathan - Nathan says Hi! \ returned to its special container and
PGP Key: at a key server near you! \ kept under refrigeration.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 14 Jun 1999 08:06:01 +0800
From: Allan Dunbar <adunbar@iinet.net.au>
Subject: Re: Songs to supers...
At 12:46 13/06/99 -0400, you wrote:
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>* "Michael (Damon) & Peni Griffin" <griffin@txdirect.net> on Sun, 13 Jun 1999
>| I've never heard "Me262",
>
>Me-262 is about the Messerschmit Me-262, the first production jet warplane
>in the world. It was used by Germany during World War II to bomb England
>during the later stages of the war.
The Me-262 was never used to bomb england. It was used entirely as a
defensive fighter in the last six months of the war to try and prevent
massed bombing raids by the allies. While it was an exceptional aircraft,
it simply did not have the range to get to England.
Just nitpicking really. :)
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 14 Jun 1999 08:13:29 +0800
From: Allan Dunbar <adunbar@iinet.net.au>
Subject: Re: Songs to supers...
At 05:44 13/06/99 -0400, you wrote:
>On 13 Jun 1999, Stainless Steel Rat wrote:
>
>> Me-262 is about the Messerschmit Me-262, the first production jet=
warplane
>> in the world. It was used by Germany during World War II to bomb England
>> during the later stages of the war.
>
>I thought it was a jet fighter, not a bomber. (Germany *did* have
>dedicated jet bombers as well)
Indeed, the Arado series of jet powered bombers were a reality, just very
ineffective. The jet engines of the time did not have the power to move the
weight of bombs the germans would have wanted.
>=20
>> | and am not familiar enough with "Veteran of the Psychic Wars" to be=
sure
>> | about those.
>>=20
>> "The Veteran of the Psychic Wars" is one of Blue =D6yster Cult's most
>> depressing songs. It is the lament of a veteran of a series of wars in
>> which nanotechnic/psionic weapons have left him a total wreck:
>>=20
>> You see me now, a veteran of a thousand psychic wars
>> My energy is spent at last and my armor is destroyed
>> I have used up all my weapons and I'm helpless and bereaved
>> Wounds are all I'm made of
>> Did I hear you say that this is victory?
>
>Co-written by Michael Moorcock (who also helped on Black Blade).
>
>--
>Michael Surbrook - susano@otd.com - http://www.otd.com/~susano/index.html
>
> "Does this planet have a never-ending supply of weird stuff!"
> Susano Orbatos, _Orion_
>
>
>
------------------------------
Date: 13 Jun 1999 20:47:55 -0400
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net>
Subject: Re: Songs to supers...
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* Allan Dunbar <adunbar@iinet.net.au> on Sun, 13 Jun 1999
| The Me-262 was never used to bomb england. It was used entirely as a
| defensive fighter in the last six months of the war to try and prevent
| massed bombing raids by the allies. While it was an exceptional aircraft,
| it simply did not have the range to get to England.
Nit-pick noted. :)
But with a 650mi round-trip ticket on internal fuel, Me-262 had longer legs
than many of the Luftwaffe's piston-engine fighter-bombers.
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- --
Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net> \ When not in use, Happy Fun Ball should be
Minion of Nathan - Nathan says Hi! \ returned to its special container and
PGP Key: at a key server near you! \ kept under refrigeration.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 19:53:53 -0500 (CDT)
From: "Dr. Nuncheon" <jeffj@io.com>
Subject: Re: Songs to supers...
On 13 Jun 1999, Stainless Steel Rat wrote:
> "The Veteran of the Psychic Wars" is one of Blue =D6yster Cult's most
> depressing songs. It is the lament of a veteran of a series of wars in
> which nanotechnic/psionic weapons have left him a total wreck:
>=20
> You see me now, a veteran of a thousand psychic wars
> My energy is spent at last and my armor is destroyed
> I have used up all my weapons and I'm helpless and bereaved
> Wounds are all I'm made of
> Did I hear you say that this is victory?
Heh. I guess I always favored a, um, less literal interpretation of the
song. I always saw it as a kind of anti-love song about a relationship
that turned to total hatred - the 'Psychic Wars' of the title. By the
time she finally leaves him, he's an emotional wreck...
But it could be the other way, too.
J
Hostes aliengeni me abduxerent. Jeff Johnston - jeffj@io.com
Qui annus est? http://www.io.com/~jeffj
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 21:22:45 -0400 (EDT)
From: Michael Surbrook <susano@dedaana.otd.com>
Subject: Re: Songs to supers...
On Sun, 13 Jun 1999, Michael (Damon) & Peni Griffin wrote:
> >> Me-262 is about the Messerschmit Me-262, the first production jet warp=
lane
> >> in the world. It was used by Germany during World War II to bomb Engl=
and
> >> during the later stages of the war.
> >
> >I thought it was a jet fighter, not a bomber. (Germany *did* have
> >dedicated jet bombers as well)
>=20
> Either way, hard to see how this fits into a supers genre.
Flying superspeedster? A super'hero' named ME-262 would certianly give me
pause.
=20
> >> "The Veteran of the Psychic Wars" is one of Blue =D6yster Cult's most
> >> depressing songs. It is the lament of a veteran of a series of wars i=
n
> >> which nanotechnic/psionic weapons have left him a total wreck:
> >
> >Co-written by Michael Moorcock (who also helped on Black Blade).
>=20
> Yes, that would explain the depressing part... :)
Indeed.=20
- --
Michael Surbrook - susano@otd.com - http://www.otd.com/~susano/index.html
"Politicians are the same all over. They promise to build a bridge
even where there is no river."
Nikita Khruschev
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 21:24:06 -0400 (EDT)
From: Michael Surbrook <susano@dedaana.otd.com>
Subject: Re: Songs to supers...
On Mon, 14 Jun 1999, Allan Dunbar wrote:
> >> Me-262 is about the Messerschmit Me-262, the first production jet warplane
> >> in the world. It was used by Germany during World War II to bomb England
> >> during the later stages of the war.
> >
> >I thought it was a jet fighter, not a bomber. (Germany *did* have
> >dedicated jet bombers as well)
>
> Indeed, the Arado series of jet powered bombers were a reality, just very
> ineffective. The jet engines of the time did not have the power to move the
> weight of bombs the germans would have wanted.
Yes, that name sounds familier. I remember read it was small, very fast,
and unhittable. Problem was, they had very few of them, it couldn't carry
enough bombs and its strikes didn't make any difference.
- --
Michael Surbrook - susano@otd.com - http://www.otd.com/~susano/index.html
"Politicians are the same all over. They promise to build a bridge
even where there is no river."
Nikita Khruschev
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 21:25:17 -0400 (EDT)
From: Michael Surbrook <susano@dedaana.otd.com>
Subject: Re: Songs to supers...
On Sun, 13 Jun 1999, Dr. Nuncheon wrote:
> > "The Veteran of the Psychic Wars" is one of Blue =D6yster Cult's most
> > depressing songs. It is the lament of a veteran of a series of wars in
> > which nanotechnic/psionic weapons have left him a total wreck:
> >=20
> > You see me now, a veteran of a thousand psychic wars
> > My energy is spent at last and my armor is destroyed
> > I have used up all my weapons and I'm helpless and bereaved
> > Wounds are all I'm made of
> > Did I hear you say that this is victory?
>=20
> Heh. I guess I always favored a, um, less literal interpretation of the
> song. I always saw it as a kind of anti-love song about a relationship
> that turned to total hatred - the 'Psychic Wars' of the title. By the
> time she finally leaves him, he's an emotional wreck...
I friend of mine had that opinion of the song as well. Me? I went with
Rat's viewpoint.
=20
- --
Michael Surbrook - susano@otd.com - http://www.otd.com/~susano/index.html
"Politicians are the same all over. They promise to build a bridge
even where there is no river."
Nikita Khruschev
------------------------------
Date: 13 Jun 1999 21:39:51 -0400
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net>
Subject: Re: Songs to supers...
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* "Dr. Nuncheon" <jeffj@io.com> on Sun, 13 Jun 1999
| Heh. I guess I always favored a, um, less literal interpretation of the
| song. I always saw it as a kind of anti-love song about a relationship
| that turned to total hatred - the 'Psychic Wars' of the title. By the
| time she finally leaves him, he's an emotional wreck...
Yeah... but that doesn't work so well for a superheroic character, does it?
:)
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Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net> \ Caution: Happy Fun Ball may suddenly
Minion of Nathan - Nathan says Hi! \ accelerate to dangerous speeds.
PGP Key: at a key server near you! \
------------------------------
Date: 13 Jun 1999 21:40:30 -0400
From: Stainless Steel Rat <ratinox@peorth.gweep.net>
Subject: Re: Songs to supers...
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* Michael Surbrook <susano@dedaana.otd.com> on Sun, 13 Jun 1999
| Flying superspeedster? A super'hero' named ME-262 would certianly give me
| pause.
Stormbird.
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------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 20:46:01 -0500
From: Ross Rannells <rossrannells@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage
geoff heald wrote:
> At 09:51 PM 6/12/99 -0500, you wrote:
> >
> >
> >Wayne Shaw wrote:
> >
> >> >Transform is the only power that explicitly says it can not be used on
> >> >the power's owner. By the rules Absorption works fine when the owner
> >> >slaps themself around. I don't let a character do so just because I
> >> >think it's abusive, but that's a house rule.
> >>
> >> Though I should note there is a character in comics who has done just that,
> >> more or less, on occasion before getting into a fight. The Black King from
> >> the X-books occasionally would slam himself into a wall to charge up if he
> >> knew a problem was coming.
> >
> >This also happened in one of the Wild Card books. The one with the
> >attack on Ellis Island. Detroit Steel was constantly hitting The Reflector
> >to make him more powerful. So while it is a rule abuse it is by no
> >means out of genre.
> >
> While it may seem excessively picky, this is a seperate issue that has
> already been addressed. It is perfectly legal for a hero to hit another
> hero who has Absorbtion to "power him up", and tow heros who both have
> Absorbtion can do it to each other. The question here is specificly if a
> hero may hit _himself_ for this purpose.
That's why I don't understand the why the discussion is going on.
I don't see a difference between the two. The fact is the target is
getting hit, where that attack is comming from makes little difference,
at least according to the way the power is written in the BBB.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 21:13:22 -0500
From: Ross Rannells <rossrannells@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Songs to supers...
Michael Surbrook wrote:
> On Sun, 13 Jun 1999, Dr. Nuncheon wrote:
>
> > > "The Veteran of the Psychic Wars" is one of Blue Öyster Cult's most
> > > depressing songs. It is the lament of a veteran of a series of wars in
> > > which nanotechnic/psionic weapons have left him a total wreck:
> > >
> > > You see me now, a veteran of a thousand psychic wars
> > > My energy is spent at last and my armor is destroyed
> > > I have used up all my weapons and I'm helpless and bereaved
> > > Wounds are all I'm made of
> > > Did I hear you say that this is victory?
> >
> > Heh. I guess I always favored a, um, less literal interpretation of the
> > song. I always saw it as a kind of anti-love song about a relationship
> > that turned to total hatred - the 'Psychic Wars' of the title. By the
> > time she finally leaves him, he's an emotional wreck...
>
> I friend of mine had that opinion of the song as well. Me? I went with
> Rat's viewpoint.
>
I used to go with the burned out love song interpretation until I saw
"Heavy Metal". I can't associate any love songs with that masterpiece
of animation. I'm firmly with Rat's interpretation on it now.
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 22:17:20 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jason Sullivan <ravanos@NJCU.edu>
Subject: Super's songs...
Lest we forget Sugarhill Gang's _Rapper's Delight_...
(I included the chorous so those who have heard the song before
will identify it with greater ease).
I said a hip hop the hippie the hippie
to the hip hip hop, a you dont stop
the rock it to the bang bang boogie say up jumped the boogie
to the rhythm of the boogie, the beat
well i was comin home late one dark afternoon
a reporter stopped me for a interview
she said she's heard stories and she's heard fables
that i'm vicious on the mike and the turntables
this young reporter i did adore
so i rocked a vicious rhyme like i never did before
she said damn fly guy im in love with you
the casanova legend must have been true
i said by the way baby what's your name
said i go by the name of lois lane
and you could be my boyfiend you surely can
just let me quit my boyfriend called superman
i said he's a fairy i do suppoose
flyin through the air in pantyhose
he may be very sexy or even cute
but he looks like a sucker in a blue and red suit
i said you need a man who's got finesse
and his whole name across his chest
he may be able to fly all through the night
but can he rock a party til the early light
he cant satisfy you with his little worm
but i can bust you out with my super sperm
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 21:27:52 -0500
From: "Michael (Damon) & Peni Griffin" <griffin@txdirect.net>
Subject: [LYRICS] Re: Super's songs...
At 10:17 PM 6/13/1999 -0400, Jason Sullivan wrote:
>
> Lest we forget Sugarhill Gang's _Rapper's Delight_...
Er, yes. Very...uh, def, I'm sure.
"I like rap as well as the next frightened Caucasian -- but would it kill
you to play a little Foghat once in a while?"
-- Jim Carrey to MTV, at this year's MTV Movie Awards
Meanwhile, I mentioned ELO Part II's "Honest Men" as having lyrics
evocative of comic book superheroes (though not quite to the extent of the
Bonnie Tyler song I posted earlier):
HONEST MEN
We're just a stone's throw
From burning hellfire
Does anybody know
Where did all the heroes go?
We've had our fill of
The gallery of scoundrels
The leaders of our world
Those power-hungry liars.
Rise up and sound the sirens!
Send out the searching parties!
All we need is a few good men.
CHORUS:
Send the S.O.S. and red alert
All across the universe:
Calling all honest men
S.O.S. emergency
Sinking fast and getting worse
Where's your honest men?
In some village far away
Or in a little town pub
High on a mountain top
There must be an honest man
Calling all honest men.
Throw out the tyrants
The aged fat cats
Outlived their usefulness
They have led us to this mess.
Make them answer
(Hold them) to their promises
And throw them in the street
If they won't tell the truth
REPEAT CHORUS
To your stations!
Man the ramparts, the barricades!
We need new heroes urgently
We need a few good honest men
Calling all honest men
Calling all honest men.
Call to him, he lives next door
Across the street, on the upper floor
It's our only hope
We need him now.
REPEAT CHORUS
Strike a blow, save the ship
We need a few good honest men
Calling all honest men
Calling all honest men.
S.O.S. across the universe
Where's your honest...
We need your honest...
Calling all honest men.
Calling out all over the world (sending out an S.O.S.)
Where's your honest men?
Looking out all over the world (calling out to save the world)
We need your honest men.
Calling our all over the world (sending out a red alert)
Where's your honest men?
Looking out all over the world (calling out to save the world)
We need your honest men.
Honest men, oohh
Calling all honest men
Save the world, oohh
Calling all honest men
Honest men, oohh...
Damon
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 23:42:21 -0400 (EDT)
From: Michael Surbrook <susano@dedaana.otd.com>
Subject: Re: Songs to supers...
On 13 Jun 1999, Stainless Steel Rat wrote:
> | Flying superspeedster? A super'hero' named ME-262 would certianly give me
> | pause.
>
> Stormbird.
Who or what is that?
- --
Michael Surbrook - susano@otd.com - http://www.otd.com/~susano/index.html
"I don't buy temporary insanity as a murder defense, 'cause people
kill people. That's an animal instinct. I think breaking into
someone's home and ironing all their clothes is temporary insanity."
Sue Kolinsky
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 23:43:43 -0400 (EDT)
From: Michael Surbrook <susano@dedaana.otd.com>
Subject: Re: Songs to supers...
On Sun, 13 Jun 1999, Ross Rannells wrote:
> I used to go with the burned out love song interpretation until I saw
> "Heavy Metal". I can't associate any love songs with that masterpiece
> of animation. I'm firmly with Rat's interpretation on it now.
Masterpiece? I dunno if I'd go that far. Personally, I think the
soundtrack is the best part about it. That and Capt Stern.
- --
Michael Surbrook - susano@otd.com - http://www.otd.com/~susano/index.html
"I don't buy temporary insanity as a murder defense, 'cause people
kill people. That's an animal instinct. I think breaking into
someone's home and ironing all their clothes is temporary insanity."
Sue Kolinsky
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 14 Jun 1999 03:51:07 GMT
From: David Graham <dgraham882@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Char: Exterminators
> >> Actually:
> >> 1. Alien Enemies may be out of print, but it isn't out of stock.
>I'm
> >>pretty sure that you can still get it from Gold Rush Games, or through
>the
> >>WebRPG online store, if not both.
> >
> >I've checked the Hero Plus catalog, the same one where you buy all the
> >Ultimate books and such, as well as the Hero Games Web site. Not seeing
>the
> >book in either of those places gave me the impression it was pretty much
>out
> >of stock.
>
> I'd encourage you to check the other two areas I mentioned above. It
>suffers from horribly (and, given the author, surprisingly) poor
>organization, but if one can get past that it includes some of the
>company's best material.
As a matter of fact, I have done just that. A check of WebRPG, Hero Games'
site, Gold Rush Games' site, even the respective sites on AOL, all turned up
zip. :/
> >> 2. It would be highly illegal, as a blatant copyright violation,
>for
> >>anyone to do as you just asked. (This, unfortunately, makes it somewhat
> >>illegal for you to even ask, though I doubt you'd be prosecuted in this
> >>case for soliciting a crime since copyright violation is mainly a
>Federal
> >>civil offense.)
> >
> >Goes to show how ignorant of copyright laws I am. For the record, there
>was
> >no intention to make profit on these sheets. I simply needed them for a
> >campaign, and saw no other way I could get them. Believe me, I would be
> >more than happy to just buy the dang book myself. The problem is finding
>a
> >copy.
>
> As (I think) Geoff mentioned, whether you make a profit off it is
>secondary to the issue of copyright violation. The real issue, as far as
>the law is concerned, is whether the copyright owners make a profit off it.
> When unauthorized copies are made, that cuts into the money that the
>copyright owners would make. Even if the work is out of print, this makes
>it less likely that it will go back into print, and still hurts the
>copyright owners.
> It's also a common fallacy that making copies like this is OK if the
>original is out of print. It's actually only a less serious violation, but
>still a violation; current US copyright law keeps any work protected until
>50 years after the author's death, unless it's explicitly donated to the
>public domain.
> As I say, one copy for personal use isn't likely to cause any major
>stink. But let's honor our creative people and not take from them.
> (On the other hand, one might be able to write to the copyright holder
>and ask for official permission to make a copy, offering to pay the amount
>of money that would be made from the sale of the item, and see what kind of
>response there is.)
Well, now I have been duly reminded why subscribers don't post to this list
every day asking for Foxbat's latest character sheet. :)
And I would much prefer to honor the respective creative talent that worked
so hard to produce such a fine supplement, and render unto them proper
royalties. Once again, the problem is that Alien Enemies seems to be out of
print, out of stock, and therefore pretty much out of reach of the usual
methods.
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 23:20:24 -0500
From: "Michael (Damon) & Peni Griffin" <griffin@txdirect.net>
Subject: Re: Char: Exterminators/Alien Enemies found
At 03:51 AM 6/14/1999 GMT, David Graham wrote:
>> I'd encourage you to check the other two areas I mentioned above. It
>>suffers from horribly (and, given the author, surprisingly) poor
>>organization, but if one can get past that it includes some of the
>>company's best material.
>
>As a matter of fact, I have done just that. A check of WebRPG, Hero Games'
>site, Gold Rush Games' site, even the respective sites on AOL, all turned up
>zip. :/
Then check some of the many online game stores that carry out of print
books. You can find a used copy rather than dismiss copyright law for your
own convenience.
This site lists Alien Enemies as available for $12.00 --
http://www.dragons-den.com/catalog/HER.html
The Sentry Box lists it for $16.00 Canadian (between $10 and $11 U.S.) --
http://www.sentrybox.com/games/roleplaying/games-rp9.html
Titan Games has it in Fine condition for $7.00 --
http://titan-games.com/titansite/rpg_items/SellPub.html#Pub-HeroGames
While it is *possible* all three stores have sold out of the book, and
haven't updated their listing yet, I found all three of these listings in
under five minutes of searching, less than ten minutes ago, so it shouldn't
be hard to turn up more listings if necessary. You don't appear to have
tried very hard to locate it.
Damon
|-----------------------------------------------------------|
|************* Beware of geeks bearing .GIFs ***************|
|-----------------------------------------------------------|
|Damon & Peni's homepages: http://www.txdirect.net/~griffin |
| Children's Books -- Dolls -- X-Files -- Pulp Magazines |
| Computers -- Gaming -- All Human Knowledge |
|-----------------------------------------------------------|
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 13 Jun 1999 22:16:26 -0700 (PDT)
From: shaw@caprica.com (Wayne Shaw)
Subject: Re: Char: Exterminators
>>While not legal, it is a remarkably silly law that is rather routinely
>>ignored. I'm generally quite respectful of intellectual property laws, but
>>I can't say I have much respect for this one.
>
> I have a problem with it as well (though not as much as you apparently
>do); I'd prefer that, at the least, some reasonable accomodation be made to
>allow personal copies to be made with the appropriate royalties paid to the
>owners.
I certainly wouldn't have a problem with forwarding some fee to the owner of
the copywrite. Though with many of that sort of thing (the long out of
print) he or she might be quite a trick to locate. But I'll bluntly and
freely admit that for items I'm using for reference purposes (such as most
game rules are), if I know something is out of print and have no reason to
believe it will return to print in any reasonable rate, I'll copy for
personal use without a moment's qualm.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 14 Jun 1999 00:09:42 -0700
From: Chad Riley <chadriley01@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: Heroes of Styx
I finished my team and am now working on some villians.
The heroes are a team formed and trained by the man known a Kilroy. He is a Doc
Savage type character almost. Brilliant in Several Fields, a master musician,
combatant, and scientist. He is joined by his cousin the more roguish Lady
Lorelai (hybrid of two songs), she while being a more than capable doctor, and
scientist, musician and dancer, is also a skilled fencer and savateuse, she has
also recieved extensive thief/seiponage training.
Rounding out the team are:
Renegade (the afore mentioned living weapon)
Blue Collar Man ( a powerful brick with construction and mechanical knowledge)
Snowblind ( a cryokinetic man with several cold/ice based abilities)
Superstar (a former astronaut turned Starburst Clone)
Miss America ( an 220+ year old brick in the superman tradition, who was born on
the fourth of july and intrinsicly knows almost all there is to know about
America - she has been fighting evil for two centuries)
and lastly,
Man of Miracles ( a relatively blatant knock off of Miracle Man of DC comics)
the Villians I am working on consist of :
Queen of Spades ( an immortal seductress with low (in a supers campaign) level
Psychic abilities. She runs a multi international organization based on cards
(lacking any Kings or othe Queens however)
Her top henchmen are Homewrecker, a clone of sorts of Lady Lorelai, Mr Roboto,
Grand Illusion, and Witch Wolf. Allied with Queenie but not part of her
organization is the Cult leader Dr Righteous, his super powered henchmen Col Hyde
and Lt Vannish; and the fearsome Cold War, a man who was to be the prieminant
American agent during the Cold War, however the "War" ended before he could begin
his mission. He has decided to ignite a second Cold War so that he can serve as
planned.
That's all I have thus Far.
What do you all think?
Chad
(PS Sorry to Damon who will undoubtably get this message twice)
"Michael (Damon) & Peni Griffin" wrote:
> At 05:24 PM 6/12/1999 -0700, you wrote:
> >tell me about it. Not to mention that many of the cd's are pretty darn
> hard to
> >find... I have been searching in vain for two of Dennis DeYoung's Cd's never
> >seen hide nor hair of them...
>
> Good luck with that. I don't have any of the solo material. I rarely pay
> attention to solo releases from any group, and didn't realize until you
> brought it up that Dennis DeYoung had more than one solo album (Desert
> Moon). I did artist searches at CDNow, Every CD and TowerRecords.com, and
> all they pulled up was "10 On Broadway".
>
> Damon
> still thinking about casting the "Electric Light Brigade"
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 14 Jun 1999 00:48:18 -0700
From: James Jandebeur <jimalj@best.com>
Subject: Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage
> Champions Deluxe, page 87:
>
> If a character wishes to teleport other individuals (without being
> teleported himself) he must buy the Usable By Others or Usable Against
> Others Power Advantages.
However, at no time in the original post did he mention that the fellow
teleporting would not be going along, so this passage has nothing to do
with it.
JAJ, Gaming Philosopher
http://www.javaman.to/philosopher.html
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 14 Jun 1999 02:18:41 -0400
From: geoff heald <gheald@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Swapping stats
At 09:28 AM 6/13/99 -0500, you wrote:
>On 13 Jun 1999, Stainless Steel Rat wrote:
>
>> * "Dr. Nuncheon" <jeffj@io.com> on Fri, 11 Jun 1999
>> | All right. Why does the mage with the magic wand get Personal Immunity
>> | for free?
>>
>> When did I ever say anything of the sort?
>
>When you said that you would not allow someone with Transfer to use it
>against themselves.
>
>J
Actually, that sounds like citing a house rule. Others have said that and
we have let it pass. What people seem to be objecting to is Rat's
assertion that _it_is_against_the_rules_ to use Transfer on one's self.
============================
Geoff Heald
============================
Attention all enemies of the Rival Ninja Corporation: You will lay down
your weapons and surrender to your nearest R.N.C. representative. Failure
to do so will result in your total destruction. Thank you.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 14 Jun 1999 02:26:08 -0400
From: geoff heald <gheald@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Swapping stats
At 10:45 AM 6/13/99 -0400, you wrote:
>-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>Hash: SHA1
>
>* Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com> on Sun, 13 Jun 1999
>| Why did this particular point come up in a discussion on whether a
>| character's Powers can affect himself?
>
>This discussion was never about whether or not a character's powers can
>affect himself. The discussion is about "swapping stats" and the power(s)
>best suited to it, and why Transfer is not an appropriate power, not
>because Transfer will not work (it certainly will if it is reflected
>(assuming it can be reflected)), but because use of Transfer is normally an
>offensive action and people do not normally attack themselves.
So your complaint is entirely aesthetic? I see nothing in the Hero rules
prohibiting one from buying "normally offensive" powers with the intention
of using them on teammates or ones' self.
============================
Geoff Heald
============================
Attention all enemies of the Rival Ninja Corporation: You will lay down
your weapons and surrender to your nearest R.N.C. representative. Failure
to do so will result in your total destruction. Thank you.
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 14 Jun 1999 03:30:50 -0400
From: geoff heald <gheald@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Songs to supers...
At 10:27 AM 6/13/99 -0500, you wrote:
>At 09:49 AM 6/13/1999 -0400, Michael Surbrook wrote:
>Other random supers references in popular songs...
>
>"Magneto & Titanium Man" (Paul McCartney & Wings)
>"Iron Man" (Black Sabbath, though no relation to the familiar comics
>character)
>"...you don't tug on Superman's cape..." (Jim Croce)
>"Wish I could fly like Superman..." (The Kinks)
>"Superman and Green Lantern ain't got nothin' on me..." (Donovan)
>"It's gonna take a Superman to sweep me off my feet" (Bonnie Tyler)
"Captain Fantastic and the Brown Dirt Cowboy" (Elton John)
Or for just lyrics, "Jam On It" (I don't know the artist)
"When Superman came to our town to see who he could rock,
He blew away every crew he played until he reached our block"
Or how about "Superheros" off the Rocky Horror Soundtrack? (Only the third
verse appears in the film, and you might not have even realized it was a song)
"I've done a lot
god knows I've tried
to find the truth
I've even lied
and all I know is
down inside
I'm bleeding
And superheroes
come to feast
and taste the flesh
not yet deceased
and all I know is
still the beast
is feeding
And crawling
on the planet's face
some insects
called the human race
lost in time
and lost in space
and meaning
============================
Geoff Heald
============================
Attention all enemies of the Rival Ninja Corporation: You will lay down
your weapons and surrender to your nearest R.N.C. representative. Failure
to do so will result in your total destruction. Thank you.
------------------------------
End of champ-l-digest V1 #393
*****************************
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Date: Friday, July 02, 1999 04:13 PM