Digest Archive vol 1 Issue 397

Digest Archive vol 1 Issue 397
From: owner-champ-l-digest@sysabend.org
Sent: Tuesday, June 15, 1999 11:31 AM
To: champ-l-digest@sysabend.org
Subject: champ-l-digest V1 #397

champ-l-digest Tuesday, June 15 1999 Volume 01 : Number 397

In this issue:

Re: Swapping stats
CHAR: Cheopthatos the Nefaratusian
Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage
Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage
Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage
Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage
Re: Swapping stats
Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage
A matter of Gravity...
Re: Hero v5 release date
Re: Damnit, Jim! I'm not a contractor! (BASE building)
Re: Hero v5 release date
Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage
Re: What's My Line? (was The Mummy)
Re: A matter of Gravity...
Re: Hero site & web design trends
Re: Data using contractions
Teleport & Extra Mass
Re: Hero site & web design trends
Re: Data using contractions
Re: Hero site & web design trends
RE: Swapping stats
Re: Data using contractions
Adjustment Powers/Elemental Control/SFX
Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage
Re: Data using contractions

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 14 Jun 1999 23:17:03 -0700
From: "Filksinger" <filkhero@deskmail.com>
Subject: Re: Swapping stats

From: James Jandebeur <james@javaman.to>

<snip>
> He did, indeed, never say that the person was immune, only that if
the
> character wants to use the generally-used-as-attack (that's PC for
Attack)
> power on themselves on a regular basis, they should not buy it that
way.

Yes, he did indeed say that a person was completely unable to use the
Powers Transfer and Drain on himself. In fact, I generally agree with
the other things he says; I object specificially to his claim that
these powers could not be used on oneself.

> I'm forced to half-way agree

<snip>

> On the other hand,

<snip>

Essentially what I think on those three points.

Filksinger

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 02:40:50 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jason Sullivan <ravanos@NJCU.edu>
Subject: CHAR: Cheopthatos the Nefaratusian

Cheopthatos the Nefaratusian

Val CHA Cost Roll Notes
10 STR 0 11- 100kg; 2d6
13 DEX 9 12- OCV: 4 / DCV: 4
10 CON 0 11-
20 BODY 20 13-
17 INT 7 13- PER Roll 13-
10 EGO 0 11- ECV: 3
15 PRE 5 12- PRE Attack: 3d6
8 COM -1 11-

2 PD 0 Total: PD / PDr
2 ED 0 Total: ED / EDr
3 SPD 7 Phases: 4, 8, 12
4 REC 0
20 END 0
40 STUN 0

Total Characteristics Cost: 47

Movement:
Running: 6" / 12"
Swimming: 2" / 4"

Cost Powers & Skills
1 KS: Diabolism 11-
1 KS: The Lower Planes & Dark Dimensions 11-
1 KS: Thanatology 11-
5 Magic 13-

3 Scholar

8 Normal Sight, Transdimensional: The Lower Planes & Dark Dimensions
(+3/4); IAF: "Polished Obsidian Mirror" (-1/2), Fragile (-1/4),
Requires Skill Roll: Magic (-1/2)

15 2d6 Transfer BODY to BODY, 0 END (+1/2); Healing Only (-1/2),
Requires Skill Roll: Magic (-1/2), Target must effectively be DCV
0 (Unconscious, Stunned, Entangled) (-1)

20 8d6 Mind Control; AoE: Radius (+1), Telepathic (+1/4), Works
vs. INT (0), Only beings he has personally created/summoned (-1),
Only works under a full moon (-1 1/2), IAF: "Black Iron Crown"
(-1/2), RSR: Magic (-1/2)

20 Mind Link: 128 Related Group of Minds at One Time:
Personally Created/Summoned Undead; Works vs. INT instead of EGO
(0); IAF: "Black Iron Crown" (-1/2), Must first have successfully
used Mind Control (-1/2)

10 Summon 128 Undead (225 pts. each); Only works under a full moon
(-1 1/2), OAF: Immobile "Altar of Evil" (-2), Only up to an
equivalent amount of dead bodies to be risen (-1/2), RSR: Magic
(-1/2), Gestures (-1/4), Incantations (-1/4), Concentration: 0 DCV
Throughout (-1), Extra Time: 5 minutes (-2), Uses BODY instead of
END (-2)

1 LS: Immune to Aging; Requires regular use of Transfer
from healthy, young subject until subject reaches negative BODY
[and subsequently dies] (-3/4)

18 90 point Base

Total Powers & Skills Cost: 150
Total Character Cost: 103

100+ Disadvantages
25 Distinctive Features: Tall, almost seven feet in height, stoop-
shouldered, and gaunt in appearance; Eyes are black, and appear
as if they were cold, unfeeling orbs like twin shards of onyx;
Deathly pallor with traditional Nefaratusian features; Ominous
aura surrounding his presence at all times; Traditional Nefaratus
garb of black boots, gloves, cloak and robes of satiny cloth,
hooded and veiled as to obscure features, worn all of the time;
Black iron crown upon head; Breathy, deep, raspy voice
(Not Concealable; Extreme)
0 Normal Characteristic Maxima
5 Physical Limitation: Can not be magically healed or Aided with
potions, salves, magical items, or Healing magic from deities; Can only
be healed by his own magic [which is Vampiric in nature] or by
"natural" healing (Infrequent, Slight)
20 Reputation: "Black Savant" (Almost Always, 14-; Extreme
Reputation)
15 Susceptibility: 3d6 Drain to All Magic when on Holy Ground
[Includes Transfer abilities] (Uncommon)
10 Susceptibility: 3d6 STUN to Sunlight
(Common)

Experience: 0
Total Disadvantage Points: 75

Designers Notes:
Cheopthatos the Nefaratusian is my attempt at making a Necromancer
type character on 150 points. At first, he started off as a joke, loosely
based on the culture of Nefaratus in _The Chronicles of Talislanta_ book
by Stephen Michael Sechi, modified to fit within my Fantasy HERO world.
Since no game stats were given, and as a whole they sounded
really, really neat... Cheopthatos was born.

Description:
Originally hailing from Nefaratus, Cheopthatos sailed to the
Midlandian shores on a chartered Arderik slave ship when he was only
twelve to reclaim the Bleak Tower built a millennia before. After
forcing the slaves to lay siege upon the paltry guards stationed there, he
oversaw the living burial of all but a tenth of his servants.
Cheopthatos has lived in the Bleak Tower most of his life,
studying the mystic arts using various objects within the tower as foci.
Most people avoid the tower, and with good reason. Guests that visit
Cheopthatos seldom return alive.
No one knows what motivates Cheopthatos. Some say he is biding
his time, waiting for an opportunity to destroy the defenses of near-by
cities so the Nefaratusian fleet may conquer the Midlands, slowly amassing
power until he is strong enough. Others say he is one of the Undead- a
foul creature incapable of emotion.

Appearance: Cheopthatos is tall, almost seven feet in height,
stoop-shouldered, and gaunt in appearance. His eyes are black, and appear
as if they were two cold, unfeeling orbs like twin shards of onyx. These
features are common among all Nefaratusians. His deathly pallor sets him
apart from others of his race, as does the palpable, ominous aura that
surrounds him. When regarding others, his voice is raspy, deep, and
breathy.
Cheopthatos wears the traditional Nefaratusian garb: black boots,
gloves, cloak and robes of satiny cloth, hooded and veiled as to obscure
features, worn all of the time. He is often found wearing an elaborately
built black iron crown upon his head.

Powers Notes:
Cheopthatos is not as skilled in the mystic arts as his brethren.
Separated from them for such a long time, he has only been able to learn
the most rudimentary of magic. Cheopthatos is certainly not in the
league of the infamous Black Savant.
Cheopthatos has, however, become skilled in some basic
Nefaratusian magic. Common among his people is the ability to gaze into
mirrors of polished obsidian, which is used to study the inhabitants of
the lower planes and dark dimensions. Black Savant use such techniques
for divination and enchantment, as well as aiding them in their various
studies.
Black Savant are also known to summon and bind demons.
Cheopthatos has not yet mastered these skills. Cheopthatos has mastered a
particularly difficult from of Necromancy. Using a special altar, he can
perform a ritual where he may rise bodies in varying states of
decomposition from the dead. The ritual only works under the light of a
full moon, and is near crippling in the effects it has on his body.
The undead have (un)life, but little in the way of motivation.
Another ritual, which requires a black iron crown as a focus, allows
Cheopthatos to control the army of undead and issue commands from any
distance.
The last ritual was created by Cheopthatos, who suffers from a
condition unique to his race. His life-energies are highly unbalanced,
and he can not use any form of magical, alchemical, herbal, or mystical
healing. Originally an attempted cure for his allergy to the sun,
Cheopthatos uses his ability to ebb life force from people to heal
himself. It also has a curious side effect of making him resistant to
aging when done regularly.

(Cheopthatos created by Jason Sullivan, character sheet created by Michael
Surbrook, Nefaratus and Nefaratus culture created by Stephan Michael Sechi
for Talislanta)

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 01:31:35 -0700
From: James Jandebeur <jimalj@best.com>
Subject: Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage

> Yes, but an Energy Blast is a power that normally (with no additional points
> spent) affects things other than the owner. Teleport only affects other
> animates if you pay additional points. The amount of those additional
> points determines how much extra mass you can move with you.

So, if you took it with Usable Against Others, would it then, in your
opinion, allow each object under 800 kg to be affected? After all, at
that point it has the ability aside from both buying up the mass and
from Area Effect to affect others.

JAJ, Gaming Philosopher
http://www.javaman.to/philosopher.html

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 01:41:00 -0700
From: James Jandebeur <jimalj@best.com>
Subject: Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage

> I think Alan came up with rather poor examples there. A better question
> would be, would TK with AoE still lift only its total STR, or its STR per
> hex, or its STR per object?

My ruling has always been that it lifts its STR per object. For what
it's worth. In my opinion, having it lift its total STR only but able to
lift multiple objects would be less of an advantage than +1, perhaps
down to +1/2 like Explosion. The logic is similar: the full Area Effect,
+1 Advantage allows the full effect to take place on every object in the
area, while Explosion has a reduced effect over most of the area.

JAJ, Gaming Philosopher
http://www.javaman.to/philosopher.html

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 01:51:33 -0700
From: James Jandebeur <jimalj@best.com>
Subject: Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage

> Then let's go back to Transer... if AE duplicates the effect "once per
> hex" or whatever (I believe you said that for TK, although it really
> should be "once per object and everything it holds" under the current
> discussion), then why doesn't the "Transfer COM->COM, Area Effect Radius
> (earth)" instantly make you the most beautiful person anywhere?

Not in the least bit: Transfer has a maximum, I see no reason to say
that Area Effect allows you to exceed that maximum. If you buy up the
maximum enough to get all those people, then you have paid the same
amount as for the Comeliness anyway.

However, you were using that as an example to make a point. Sorry about
that.

> Basically, since the Power already lists a cost for "affecting more stuff",
> you shouldn't try to sneak "LOTS more stuff" into the equation by buying
> another advantage.

I have seen nothing wrong with this kind of sneaking in: Radius
Teleports with increased mass are going to be hideously expensive,
should be, but are not so bad that they have ever bothered me when
they've come up. So, yes, you're meaner than me.

> You can't buy (Darkness, 1" radius), then buy "Area
> Effect Radius, x256 (+3)" for a total of 40 points, and use it the same
> as (Darkness, 256" radius) bought for 2560 pts. You just can't.

That's true. Which is a shame, since you can buy a power that destroys
everything in such a radius utterly for that same cost. Very very
utterly. I have always had a serious problem that completely destroying
a state costs less than plunging a village into darkness.

JAJ, Gaming Philosopher
http://www.javaman.to/philosopher.html

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 01:54:10 -0700
From: James Jandebeur <jimalj@best.com>
Subject: Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage

> And that's a flaw with Darkness, IMO. It's too hard to make a large one
> compared to every other power in the game.

Not quite true: Force Wall, if memory serves, is worse. It goes up by
circumference in linear progression. At least Darkness goes up by
radius.

JAJ, Gaming Philosopher
http://www.javaman.to/philosopher.html

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 01:57:29 -0700
From: James Jandebeur <jimalj@best.com>
Subject: Re: Swapping stats

> However, there is nothing in that that prevents it from being used
> against oneself as an _abnormal_ occurrence. In other words, this
> isn't an argument that you can't Drain or Transfer your own stats;
> only that it is the wrong power for _normal_ use.

Which is what the original post was about: a power that would allow
Strength to grow while Intelligence shrank for the Hulk-like
Madder==Stronger effect.

JAJ, Gaming Philosopher
http://www.javaman.to/philosopher.html

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 01:40:39 -0700 (PDT)
From: shaw@caprica.com (Wayne Shaw)
Subject: Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage

>> And that's a flaw with Darkness, IMO. It's too hard to make a large one
>> compared to every other power in the game.
>
>Not quite true: Force Wall, if memory serves, is worse. It goes up by
>circumference in linear progression. At least Darkness goes up by
>radius.

I tend not to think of Force Wall as an area power, but you may have a
point. I'm not sure an increase of area without defense wouldn't be a
legitimate concept, however, which seems to be precluded in practical terms
from Darkness.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 02:34:29 -0700 (PDT)
From: George Sulea <geovoice@yahoo.com>
Subject: A matter of Gravity...

I've got a question or two about gravity related abilities. I am
working on a 250 pt character, that has gravity based powers. Now, I
was thinking of using TK as the base, with limitaition, only affects
mass. The power works for the character both ways both to INCREASE and
to DECREASE the gravity around a target object. Now my question, I
thought I could connect this to an offensive use of the DENSITY power,
but can the density ability be reversed, and combined with another
ability, such as GLIDING, to render a target floating and helpless, or
would ENTAGLE be a better option.

Just fishing for advice here, folks, my last character didn't translate
well, but I think this one has definite possibilities.

Dazed and confused,
Geo
===
Discussion is an exchange of knowledge; an argument an exchange ofignorance.
- Robert Quillen
We forfeit 3/4 of our lives to be like other people.
- - Arthur Shopenhauer
_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 06:44:51 -0400 (EDT)
From: Michael Surbrook <susano@dedaana.otd.com>
Subject: Re: Hero v5 release date

On Mon, 14 Jun 1999, S A Rudy wrote:

> I was wondering. I've seen August mentioned as a release for Hero 5th
> edition.
>
> Could this mean it will be ready for Gen Con?

I sure hope so.

- --
Michael Surbrook - susano@otd.com - http://www.otd.com/~susano/index.html

A train station is where trains stop. A bus station is where buses stop.
Well, I'm at a workstation.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 06:04:14 -0700
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com>
Subject: Re: Damnit, Jim! I'm not a contractor! (BASE building)

At 11:51 PM 6/14/1999 -0400, Jason Sullivan wrote:
>
> And so it has come time for me to make a base for the evil
>villain.
> It's a Necromancer's Tower.
> He has spent 17 points (85 total) for the base.
>
> It is in a distant location. It is made of strange black stone
>(DEF 8, BODY 8), a hundred feet in height, decorated with graven images of
>leering devils. It has a magic lab.
>
>The Questions:
> Since I'm scraping up for points, and this is a some what spindly
>tower, I was wonder what the trade off ratio would be from height/width,
>and what I could realistically get away with while still getting my
>hundred foot tall tower. Game mechanics and real world equivalents would
>help me put this into perspective.

I can't help you much with the real-world stuff, but I can point out one
game mechanic point: when building a base, forget about any listed
height-width ratios, and just build whatever seems right for the total
number of floor hexes.
Also, since this is a *wizard's* tower, you probably could get away with
throwing out real-world considerations of how skinny a building can be and
still be sturdy.

> I'm hoping I have enough points left over to throw in a few piddle
>guards and torturers for a dungeon/torture chamber.

Have fun! :-]
- ---
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page! [Circle of HEROS member]
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm
Merry-Go-Round Webring -- wanna join?
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/merrhome.htm
Interested in sarrusophones? Join the Sarrusophone Mailing List!
http://www.onelist.com/subscribe/Sarrusophone

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 06:09:13 -0700
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com>
Subject: Re: Hero v5 release date

At 09:08 PM 6/14/1999 PDT, S A Rudy wrote:
>I was wondering. I've seen August mentioned as a release for Hero 5th
>edition.
>
>Could this mean it will be ready for Gen Con?

I believe that Bruce has, at some point, mentioned that as the intent.
- ---
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page! [Circle of HEROS member]
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm
Merry-Go-Round Webring -- wanna join?
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/merrhome.htm
Interested in sarrusophones? Join the Sarrusophone Mailing List!
http://www.onelist.com/subscribe/Sarrusophone

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 06:27:12 -0700
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com>
Subject: Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage

At 12:24 AM 6/15/1999 -0500, you wrote:
>
>
>> I think Alan came up with rather poor examples there. A better
>question
>> would be, would TK with AoE still lift only its total STR, or its STR per
>> hex, or its STR per object?
>
>I can't really disagree with you as to my examples being poor. If they
>failed to make my point they are obviously poor. I can't see why they are
>poor, though.

Your response to Rat proved me wrong. I was mistaken as to the point
you were trying to make; once you made your point, I saw my error.

>On the other hand, didn't you just SSR a hard time for taking a side trip.
>Area Effect TK is a separate argument that based on my reading is even less
>clear than this one.

What I'm referring to here, is that the difference with this aspect of
Teleport is the same that I'd apply to Telekinesis: mass. If a Power
affects a certain amount of mass, then that's how much mass it can affect.
Damaging Powers with AoE still do their total damage, and mass-affecting
Powers with AoE affect their total mass.

>Note: this was sent directly to you so if you respond on list, which is fine
>with me if you want to, you should probably quote a larger part of the
>message than you normally would since no one else has seen it.

Yeah, I'm quoting the whole thing back, and responding to more of it
than I normally would have, for just that reason. :-]

>BTW: Where is the Ultimate Super Vehicle? Some of us here in Mobile, AL
>are rather eager to get a look.

Search me. Ask Bruce.
- ---
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page! [Circle of HEROS member]
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm
Merry-Go-Round Webring -- wanna join?
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/merrhome.htm
Interested in sarrusophones? Join the Sarrusophone Mailing List!
http://www.onelist.com/subscribe/Sarrusophone

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 06:34:51 -0700
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com>
Subject: Re: What's My Line? (was The Mummy)

At 09:53 PM 6/14/1999 -0700, Filksinger wrote:
>From: <Akirazeta@aol.com>
>
>
>> In a message dated 6/10/99 7:15:29 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
>> haerandir@hotmail.com writes:
>>
>> << > "It is... it is........ it is green."
>>
>> That's easy! It's the sound of Lt. Data trying to identify an
>apparently
>> unidentifiable drink for the benefit of Montgomery Scott. >>
>>
>> Man, i thought it was from the Episode of Star trek The original
>series where
>> scotty has to get one of the super soldiers drunk enough to pass
>out, and he
>> has gone through all his "stach" and is left with one bottle. When
>the
>> soldier asks what it is, he says" Its, its, its green."
>
>In a way, it is both. Where do you think the writers of TNG got the
>idea for the line from?

Strictly speaking, the line I quoted is Data. This is precisely how the
discussion of whether or not Data is capable of using contractions got
started (though I intended it to be a discussion how of it would be built
as a Distinctive Feature).
- ---
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page! [Circle of HEROS member]
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm
Merry-Go-Round Webring -- wanna join?
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/merrhome.htm
Interested in sarrusophones? Join the Sarrusophone Mailing List!
http://www.onelist.com/subscribe/Sarrusophone

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 09:35:57 -0400
From: Bill Svitavsky <nbymail11@mln.lib.ma.us>
Subject: Re: A matter of Gravity...

At 02:34 AM 6/15/99 -0700, George Sulea wrote:
>
>I've got a question or two about gravity related abilities. I am
>working on a 250 pt character, that has gravity based powers. Now, I
>was thinking of using TK as the base, with limitaition, only affects
>mass. The power works for the character both ways both to INCREASE and
>to DECREASE the gravity around a target object.

Technically speaking, altering gravity would be "only affects weight," not
"only affects mass." There are some important differences between them -
for example, damage from momentum.

Now my question, I
>thought I could connect this to an offensive use of the DENSITY power,
>but can the density ability be reversed, and combined with another
>ability, such as GLIDING, to render a target floating and helpless, or
>would ENTAGLE be a better option.
>

What exactly do you mean by *connecting* this to an offensive use of the
Density power? It sounds like the TK shares some special effects with your
Density Increase, but wouldn't have any connection in power construction
(though you could put them both in an Elemental Control.)

As far as making a target float in mid-air, different people prefer
different approaches. Telekinesis does this effect pretty well, but causes
an odd situation where characters with high STR can somehow muscle their
way out of it. Some people prefer Flight, Usable Against Others, but this
is an easily abusable construct. Entangle doesn't seem like any improvement
over TK, as the breaking out mechanism is even more removed from the effect
of gravity's constant pull.

I have a character with powers similar to what you're describing. His name
is Cygnus, and he has various Black Hole powers including Density Increase
and Gravity Con trol (built asTelekinesis, only to affect weight.)

Bill Svitavsky

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 06:39:18 PDT
From: S A Rudy <sarudy@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Hero site & web design trends

Jason Sullivan writes:
>On Mon, 14 Jun 1999, S A Rudy wrote:
>>In fact, I think the entire black navigation bar could be
>>removed and the navigation functions incorporated into the
>>whitespace nagivation bar to better effect. Of course,
>>that would reduce the cute java mouseover effects, but aside
>>from saying "hey, we have cool mouseover java effects",
>>they don't really add value to the site.
>I, personally, like pull down/pop up java menus, menu-search
>listings (one list of possible page choices that you can even access from
>text only non graphic non frame non java browsers like mine), and
>enter-word whole site searches.
>They take up little space and are easy to access for most users... even if
>they have their own seperate pages that you
>can access by clicking a floating javafied Hero-Hex logo button that stays
>at the bottom of the screen.

I haven't got any problem with java or javascript in general
and I never said I did.

However, the hero site has none of the useful java navigation
funtions you mentioned. They have a function where, when
you mouseover a menu element, the element gets a halo (well,
an alternate graphic anyway) and a redundant little blurb
appears nearby explaining what the menu element is supposed to
link to.

Have you visited the site? Take a look and I think you'll
understand a little better what I was talking about.

- -S

S A Rudy http://www.eclipse.net/~srudy
+----------------------------------------------------------+
|"I myself have never been able to find out precisely what |
| feminism is; I only know that people call me a feminist |
| whenever I express sentiments that differentiate me from |
a doormat or a prostitute." -- Rebecca West, 1913 |
+----------------------------------------------------------+

_______________________________________________________________
Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 08:58:28 -0500 (CDT)
From: "Dr. Nuncheon" <jeffj@io.com>
Subject: Re: Data using contractions

On Mon, 14 Jun 1999 jayphailey@juno.com wrote:

> Data's behavior towards his friends reveals that yes, indeed he does have
> emotions, just fro some reason he doesn't think so, no will he admit it.
> And yes, Some times 7-of-9 is quite ruthless...

Does he have emotions, though, or does he intellectually know that
some things are 'wrong' or have unacceptable consequences - including
social ones that 7 of 9 would not be aware of? After all, he was 'raised'
with something akin to Federation values, while 7 of 9 wasn't...

J

Hostes aliengeni me abduxerent. Jeff Johnston - jeffj@io.com
Qui annus est? http://www.io.com/~jeffj

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 08:59:21 -0500 (CDT)
From: Curt Hicks <exucurt@exu.ericsson.se>
Subject: Teleport & Extra Mass

Suppose I have bought Teleport Usable Against Others
with Extra Mass*. Can I teleport an entire truck filling more than one hex ?
Or do I have to buy area effect as well ?

Curt

*yes, the extra mass IS sufficient to teleport the weight of the truck..

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 10:13:31 EDT
From: Leah L Watts <llwatts@juno.com>
Subject: Re: Hero site & web design trends

>I visited the revamped Hero Games site tonight and am not very happy
>with
>the layout. It seems to be fairly typical of commercial sites these
>days
>to incorporate wide banners, frames and/or button bars into the page,
>squeezing out the actual page content in the process.

The previous site had a no-frames option -- any chance of getting it
back? It's going to be really annoying trying to read a Digital Hero
article in that little frame.

Leah

___________________________________________________________________
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Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month!
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 10:13:31 EDT
From: Leah L Watts <llwatts@juno.com>
Subject: Re: Data using contractions

>Does he? I sometimes thought so, but was never quite certain.
>For example, apparently emotional responses could be due to built-in
>ethical or human relations programs, rather than because he actually
>feels things. He is also trying to emulate humans, after all, and
>demonstrates considerable acting skill in later episodes, and so may
>be
>_acting_ as if he had emotions. He also indicated that appearing to
>have
>emotions was one of the ways he attempted to understand emotions.

Emotions tend to cause consistent physical effects, one trick covered in
acting class was how to copy those effects if your character was supposed
to be feeling a certain emotion. There's no reason Data couldn't learn
and use that trick. It would take him what, half a second to download
every acting textbook in the Federation library system? :) Since one
side effect of that trick is that the actor may actually feel some of the
emotion being mimicked, he may see it as a way to try to gain emotion.

Leah

___________________________________________________________________
Get the Internet just the way you want it.
Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month!
Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 10:29:09 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jason Sullivan <ravanos@NJCU.edu>
Subject: Re: Hero site & web design trends

On Tue, 15 Jun 1999, S A Rudy wrote:
> Jason Sullivan writes:
> >On Mon, 14 Jun 1999, S A Rudy wrote:
> >>In fact, I think the entire black navigation bar could be
> >>removed and the navigation functions incorporated into the
> >>whitespace nagivation bar to better effect. Of course,
> >>that would reduce the cute java mouseover effects, but aside
> >>from saying "hey, we have cool mouseover java effects",
> >>they don't really add value to the site.
> >I, personally, like pull down/pop up java menus, menu-search
> >listings (one list of possible page choices that you can even access from
> >text only non graphic non frame non java browsers like mine), and
> >enter-word whole site searches.
> >They take up little space and are easy to access for most users... even if
> >they have their own seperate pages that you
> >can access by clicking a floating javafied Hero-Hex logo button that stays
> >at the bottom of the screen.
>
> I haven't got any problem with java or javascript in general
> and I never said I did.
>
> However, the hero site has none of the useful java navigation
> funtions you mentioned. They have a function where, when
> you mouseover a menu element, the element gets a halo (well,
> an alternate graphic anyway) and a redundant little blurb
> appears nearby explaining what the menu element is supposed to
> link to.
>
> Have you visited the site? You might want to before you
> start commenting on site reviews.

Been there, done that... I don't have any problems with java
either (aside from the fcat my normal browser can't use them). The site
could navigate easier, and have more space, and use pop up windows as
opposed to fixed frames to aid in navigation. It would give the folks at
HERO a larger palette to work on, and possibly make the site more
asthetically pleasing, instead of, like you said, have "redundant blurbs."

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 17:10:21 +0200
From: Henrik Giese <henrik.giese@lgp.se>
Subject: RE: Swapping stats

This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand
this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.

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charset="iso-8859-1"
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As long as it hasn't gotten to late to get back to the original topic,
here's how I would do it:

DISADVANTAGE (15 pts): Susceptibility to using more than 20(?) STR, =
Drain 1
INT (return rate down 13 steps)
POWER (15 pts): Aid STR =BDD6 (max A LOT), 0 END, triggered by INT =
drain
(-1?), loss rate down several steps

Net cost: 0 pts. Caused by a transformation attack or a nasty GM <G>...

/Henrik

- -----Original Message-----
From: James Jandebeur [mailto:jimalj@best.com]
Sent: den 15 juni 1999 10:57
To: Champions
Subject: Re: Swapping stats

> However, there is nothing in that that prevents it from being used
> against oneself as an _abnormal_ occurrence. In other words, this
> isn't an argument that you can't Drain or Transfer your own stats;
> only that it is the wrong power for _normal_ use.

Which is what the original post was about: a power that would allow
Strength to grow while Intelligence shrank for the Hulk-like
Madder=3D=3DStronger effect.

JAJ, Gaming Philosopher
http://www.javaman.to/philosopher.html

- ------_=_NextPart_001_01BEB741.2FFF0AB0
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>
<META HTTP-EQUIV=3D"Content-Type" CONTENT=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META NAME=3D"Generator" CONTENT=3D"MS Exchange Server version =
5.5.2448.0">
<TITLE>RE: Swapping stats</TITLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY>

As long as it hasn't gotten to late to get back to =
the original topic, here's how I would do it:


DISADVANTAGE (15 pts): Susceptibility to using more =
than 20(?) STR, Drain 1 INT (return rate down 13 steps)
 POWER (15 pts): Aid STR =BDD6 (max A LOT), 0 END, =
triggered by INT drain (-1?), loss rate down several steps


Net cost: 0 pts. Caused by a transformation attack or =
a nasty GM <G>...


/Henrik


-----Original Message-----
 From: James Jandebeur [<A =
HREF=3D"mailto:jimalj@best.com">mailto:jimalj@best.com</A>]
 Sent: den 15 juni 1999 10:57
 To: Champions
 Subject: Re: Swapping stats

 

> However, there is nothing in that that prevents =
it from being used
 > against oneself as an _abnormal_ occurrence. In =
other words, this
 > isn't an argument that you can't Drain or =
Transfer your own stats;
 > only that it is the wrong power for _normal_ =
use.


Which is what the original post was about: a power =
that would allow
 Strength to grow while Intelligence shrank for the =
Hulk-like
 Madder=3D=3DStronger effect.


JAJ, Gaming Philosopher
 <A HREF=3D"http://www.javaman.to/philosopher.html" =
TARGET=3D"_blank">http://www.javaman.to/philosopher.html</A>


</BODY>
</HTML>
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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 11:13:00 -0400
From: Bill Svitavsky <nbymail11@mln.lib.ma.us>
Subject: Re: Data using contractions

At 10:13 AM 6/15/99 EDT, Leah L Watts wrote:
>>Does he? I sometimes thought so, but was never quite certain.
>>For example, apparently emotional responses could be due to built-in
>>ethical or human relations programs, rather than because he actually
>>feels things. He is also trying to emulate humans, after all, and
>>demonstrates considerable acting skill in later episodes, and so may
>>be
>>_acting_ as if he had emotions. He also indicated that appearing to
>>have
>>emotions was one of the ways he attempted to understand emotions.
>
>Emotions tend to cause consistent physical effects, one trick covered in
>acting class was how to copy those effects if your character was supposed
>to be feeling a certain emotion. There's no reason Data couldn't learn
>and use that trick. It would take him what, half a second to download
>every acting textbook in the Federation library system? :) Since one
>side effect of that trick is that the actor may actually feel some of the
>emotion being mimicked, he may see it as a way to try to gain emotion.
>

I thought ST:TNG was terribly inconsistent on Data's emotions. He clearly
felt friendship for his crewmates, even if he did describe it as "the
pleasing effect of familiar patterns in my neural subroutines" or somesuch.
There was one episode I recall, though, that actually did something with
the concept of Data having no real emotions. He got involved in a romance,
then brought it to an abrupt halt with no feeling whatsoever.

Even more interesting were some suggestions toward the end of the series
that Data was designed with a subconscious. It's been a while, but I recall
Dr. Soong (sp.?) appearing to him in a dream filled with lots of dreamlike
imagery. The better Data stories dealt with the fact that consciousness is
a pretty complex subject, artificial or not.

Bill Svitavsky

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 11:20:35 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jason Sullivan <ravanos@NJCU.edu>
Subject: Adjustment Powers/Elemental Control/SFX

There has been some discussion on this list previously about
Elemental Control having innate drawbacks and advantages over the same
collection of powers outside an Elemental Control.
The standard Elemental Control requires unifing Special Effects.
The House Rule (which was introduced in an issue of AC) specified the
Elemental Control could be Drained as a whole.
Does this mean that other Adjustment Powers, such as Aid or
Absorbtion, can Adjust an entire Elemental Control Framework?

Here is an example of an Elemental Control Framework, following
which I have questions about it's mechanics:

28 EC: "Magic Eating"
30a 4.5d6 Absorbtion, Magic SFX into EC/Absorbtion/Armor/Aid,
Fade Rate: Five Minutes (+1), Persistant (+1/2)

19b Armor: 19 rPD/19 rED; Only up to Ammount rolled on Absorbtion
(-1/2)

21c 2d6 Aid: Elemental Control EC (+2), Fade Rate: Five Hours (+1
1/2), 0 END (+1/2), Persistant (+1/2), Damage Shield (+1/2);
Self Only (-1/2)

98 points total

Both the Absorbtion and Aid Adjust the Framework as a whole.
A magical attack with be Absorbed, and trigger the Aid (if you rule the
Damage Shield only works against hand-to-hand attacks, adjust
accordingly).
The Absorbtion/Aid combination boosts the maxium capacity of the
EC, as well as increasing the maxium ammount the EC can be adjusted.

Is this the way it works?

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 08:28:55 -0700
From: Christopher Taylor <ctaylor@viser.net>
Subject: Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage

At 01:54 AM 6/15/99 -0700, James Jandebeur wrote:
>> And that's a flaw with Darkness, IMO. It's too hard to make a large one
>> compared to every other power in the game.
>
>Not quite true: Force Wall, if memory serves, is worse. It goes up by
>circumference in linear progression. At least Darkness goes up by
>radius.

I left force wall the way it is, but I changed Darkness, Images, and Change
Environment because their area effect rules blow. Each one has NO area,
affecting only a single target. To affect an area, simply use the AE rules
as printed for any other power.

- --------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sola Gracia Sola Scriptura Sola Fide
Soli Deo Gloria Solus Christus Corum Deo
- --------------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Jun 1999 10:30:46 -0500
From: "Guy Hoyle" <ghoyle1@airmail.net>
Subject: Re: Data using contractions

On 6/15/99 at 11:13 AM Bill Svitavsky wrote:
>I thought ST:TNG was terribly inconsistent on Data's emotions. He clearly
>felt friendship for his crewmates, even if he did describe it as "the
>pleasing effect of familiar patterns in my neural subroutines" or=
somesuch.
>There was one episode I recall, though, that actually did something with
>the concept of Data having no real emotions. He got involved in a romance,
>then brought it to an abrupt halt with no feeling whatsoever.

That was one of my favorite episodes, because it did explore Data's=
personality so effectively. Up until then I really didn't like Data, and=
he's still not a favorite of mine, but that episode was really effective=
at portraying his means of interacting with the others. It was far better=
than "Data's Day", which was a day-in-the-life style episode with Chief=
O'Brien's wedding day as a backdrop.

Guy

------------------------------

End of champ-l-digest V1 #397
*****************************

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Date: Friday, July 02, 1999 04:13 PM