Digest Archive vol 1 Issue 407

Digest Archive vol 1 Issue 407
From: owner-champ-l-digest@sysabend.org
Sent: Thursday, June 17, 1999 6:40 PM
To: champ-l-digest@sysabend.org
Subject: champ-l-digest V1 #407

champ-l-digest Thursday, June 17 1999 Volume 01 : Number 407

In this issue:

Re: Draining Innate abilities
RE: House Rules that become "real."
Re: dialects
Re: Ultimate Super Vehicle, When? [was Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage]
CHAR: Colonel Steve Austin
RE: House Rules that become "real."
Re: dialects
Re: CHAR: Colonel Steve Austin
Re: CHAR: Colonel Steve Austin
Re: CHAR: Colonel Steve Austin
Re: Darkness (Was RE: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage)
Re: dialects
Re: Draining Innate abilities
Re: House Rules that become "real."
RE: The Metric System
[WOT] Band Stuff (was Re: dialects)
RE: Clarifying a point(attn:HERO)
RE: The Metric System [was...Space Battleship]
If we aren't Americans, what are we? (Was: Metric System)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 08:25:28 -0700 (PDT)
From: Joe Mucchiello <jmucchiello@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Draining Innate abilities

- --- David Nasset <dnasset@cns.eds.com> wrote:
> >From: Joe Mucchiello [SMTP:jmucchiello@yahoo.com]
> >I disagree with this completely. You should always avoid Transform
> >where something else exists to do it.
>
> Good rule of thumb, bad rule. Using this rule, many horrendously
> abusive powers using UAO would be the right way to go, rather than a
> reasonably priced Transform.

I don't see how the amount of BODY something has should affect how well
it is Drained. Transform is a silly mechanic for making a ghost solid.

I don't understand why you think the catch-all /
I-can't-figure-out-a-better-way mechanic is not horrendously abusive.
I prefer UAO powers. I don't think they are that abusive. I also like
the Usable On Other rules from HA1. Your reasonable priced Transform
is a hack. Why not make the result of the Transform an anvil. If you
are going to use enough power to kill your victim just to make him
shorter/taller/solider, wouldn't you have been better served by killing
him?

> >If Drain Desolid is SFXed as a
> >solidifying of molecular cohesion, it cannot effect the ghost.
> >Likewise, if it's SFX is to pull ghosts back into this plane of
> >existence, then it cannot effect Kitty Pride or Vision.
>
> You are basing this on SFX rather than upon the Power and Advantages
> and Limitations. This is not unreasonable; in fact, it makes a great
> deal of sense.
>
> However, it damages play balance. If you do this, then you are
> penalizing people who bought Drain Desolid, while granting a free
> defense to people who bought unusual SFX on their Powers. The more
> unusual the SFX, the greater the likelihood that they are immune to
> Powers aimed at countering them.

So? I don't see the big deal here. The point system is not precise in
HERO. There are lots of things that cost a little too much and other
things which cost slightly too little. The GM is there to make sure
that a balance is maintained.

> For example, let us suppose that I want to create a character who is,
> by nature, Desolid all the time. I discover that, in the campaign
> universe, 95% of all Desolid beings go Desolid due to dimensional
> shifting, and that, because of this, 95% of all Suppresses, Dispels,
> Drains, and Transfers that are aimed at preventing the use of
> Desolidification work against dimensional shifting. So I create Mist,
> who is Desolid because he is a creature made of mist. I now am immune
> to 95% of all Drains in the campaign universe for free.

How many Desolid Drains are there reasonably going to be in a campaign
anyway? If the GM thinks this is unbalanced he will say no. Yours is
a strawman argument. What about if only 85% of the campaign's
Desolidifications are based on dimension shifting? Or 75%? 65%? At
what point is Mist's desolid no longer Innate? My way, the foe will
come along eventually who can make Mist solid. Your way, there can be
no such foe.

> OTOH, if we include Innate (and, preferably, other, similar,
> Advantages), then Mist is the one who pays for the immunity, rather
> than having the immunity for free.

The problem is HERO strives not to include absolutes. I don't see why
you being made of Mist is more Innate than the dimension shifter is.
With Innate, your Desolid can NEVER be drained, even if someone makes a
Drain Desolid vs mist creatures. That is not reasonable.

> >> >Seems like that would be a useful
> >> >spell/power for fighting ghosts.
> >>
> >> It would be. 1d6 Transformation: Ghost into living being,
> >> Cumulative.
> >
> >Who said the ghost would be living? He could remain undead. All I
> >was doing was making him substantial. Removing his (lowercase)
> >innate ability to move through objects solid on this plane.
>
> He wouldn't have to be living. You could change him into a mobile
> corpse, for example. However, using your method, he would be solid,
> capable of being cut, take STUN from being punched, subject to
> bleeding rules, etc.,. Sounds pretty much like living to me.

Yes, and the Drain does it. Or are you thinking in terms of the Spirit
rules? I never use them. The ghost, for me, has a STUN and BODY and
can bleed since it's not an automaton. Drain is the way to go.
Afterall, if I were hunting ghosts and I could Transform them in living
corpses, wouldn't I be better served by Transforming them into
doorknobs?

Joe

_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 11:21:04 -0400
From: Bill Svitavsky <nbymail11@mln.lib.ma.us>
Subject: RE: House Rules that become "real."

At 04:45 PM 6/17/99 +0200, Henrik Giese wrote:
> Even tho' we finally noticed that we're wrong, we still play that
>using an attack doesn't end your phase. ie, attack on phase N (=BD phase)
>then again on phanse N+1 (rest of phase), if you attack twice in a phase,
>you get a -2 OCV. =20

Wow - that's a pretty extreme one. I would think this makes characters with
Desolidification nigh-unstoppable; it's pretty close to a free Affects
Desolid on all their attacks. Characters with high movement would be
similarly difficult to deal with. An extra attack doesn't mean all that
much, but the ability to attack then immediately launch a defense changes
combat dynamics a lot.

Can you give us any observations about how this affects your combats &
character construction?

Bill Svitavsky

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 08:27:55 -0700 (PDT)
From: Ben Brown <benbrown@primenet.com>
Subject: Re: dialects

On Thu, 17 Jun 1999, S A Rudy wrote:

> I was in my high school's marching band. We held the cheerleaders largely
> in contempt. (Of course, this may have had something to do with the fact
> that, due to the socioeconomic dynamic of the school, we were a
> significantly higher quality band than they were a cheerleading squad.)
>

I don't think it's a quality thing, although that certainly exacerbates
the contempt. I've never met a high school marching band that didn't hold
the cheerleaders in contempt. It largely stems from the feeling that no
matter how good the band is, they're always going to be sort of an
afterthought, while cheerleaders are percieved as being part and parcel
with the "popular crowd".

[continue ex-band-geek grumble in this vein for several pages]

- -Ben

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 11:51:51 EDT
From: HeroGames@aol.com
Subject: Re: Ultimate Super Vehicle, When? [was Re: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage]

In a message dated 6/16/99 7:23:55 PM, alaneasley@email.com writes:

>Hi, Bruce. Where is the Ultimate Super Vehicle? Some of us here in Mobile=
,
>
>AL are rather eager to get a look.
>
>

We need to finish the 5th Edition Hero System before we can work on TUSV.

=97 Steve Peterson, Hero Games=20

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 12:15:52 -0400 (EDT)
From: Michael Surbrook <susano@dedaana.otd.com>
Subject: CHAR: Colonel Steve Austin

"... a man barely alive. We can rebuild him."

COLONEL STEVE AUSTIN

Val CHA Cost Roll Notes
15 STR 5 12- 200kg; 3d6
18 DEX 24 13- OCV: 6 / DCV: 6
23 CON 26 14-
15 BODY 10 12-
15 INT 5 12- PER Roll 12-
18 EGO 16 13- ECV: 6
15 PRE 5 12- PRE Attack: 3d6
18 COM 4 13-
9 PD 6 Total: 9 PD
7 ED 2 Total: 7 ED
4 SPD 12 Phases: 3, 6, 9, 12
8 REC 0
50 END 2
35 STUN 0
Total Characteristics Cost: 117

Movement: Running: 7" / 14"
Swimming: 6" / 12"

Cost Powers & Skills
Combat Training:
10 Combat Skill Levels: +2 with HTH
Martial Arts: Aikido, Boxing, Judo, Wrestling
Maneuver OCV DCV Damage
4 Block +2 +2 Block, Abort
4 Cross +0 +2 STR + 2d6 Strike
4 Disarm -1 +1 Disarm, +10 STR to roll
4 Dodge +0 +5 Dodge vs All, Abort
4 Escape +0 +0 +15 STR vs Grabs
3 Hold/Joint Lock -1 -1 Grab Two Limbs; +10 STR to Hold
3 Jab +2 +1 STR Strike
3 Legsweep +2 -1 STR +1d6 Strike; Target Falls
5 Redirect +1 +3 Block, Abort
3 Takedown +1 +1 STR Strike; Target Falls
3 Sacrifice Throw +2 +1 STR Strike; You/Target Falls
3 Slam/Throw +0 +1 STR + v/5; Target Falls

Bionic/Cybernetic Implants:
13 Bionic Arm: +18 STR, 0 END (+1/2), Does not affect figured (-1/2),
STR only affects use with Left arm (-1/2)
13 Bionic Legs: +18 STR, 0 END (+1/2), Does not affect
figured (-1/2), STR only affects use with legs (-1/2)
16 Bionic Legs: Running: +1" (7" Total), 0 END (+1/2),
Persistant (+1/2) [on 7"]
27 Bionic Limbs: Damage Reduction: 3/4, Physical, Resistant, Only
affects Locations 6-8 [left arm] & 14-18 (-3/4), Stun Only (-1/2)
7 Dart Gun: RKA: 1/2d6, 12 Shots (-1/4), Reduced Range (-1/4)
80 Dart Gun: RKA: 4d6, NND [DEF: appropriate immunity, alien
metabolism or antivenin] (+1), Does BODY (+1), Linked to
RKA (-1/2), RKA must do BODY (-1/2), 12 Shots (-1/4)
8 Eye Camera: Eidetic Memory, Vision Only (-1/2), 20 Uses (+1/4)
7 Internal Air: Supply: Life Support: Self-contained breathing, 1
Charge of 30 Minutes (-1/2)
10 Internal Radio: High Range Radio Hearing
15 Steel-Laced Fist: HKA: 1d6 (2d6 with STR), 0 END (+1/2), Left hand
only (-1/2)
7 Swim Fins: Swimming: +4" (6" total), 0 END (+1/2)

Air Force / Astronaut Skills:
2 Contact: Oscar Goldman / OSO 11-
3 Perk: Military Rank [Colonel]
5 Combat Pilot 14-
5 KS: Military Aircraft 14-
3 KS: Zero-G Operations 13-
7 Navigation 13-
2 PS: Air Force Officer / Test Pilot 11-
2 PS: Astronaut 11-
3 Systems Operation 12-
5 TF: Helicopters, Planes, SCUBA, Small Space Craft
5 WF: Epee, Knife, Small Arms, Vehicle Weapons

Background Skills:
3 Acrobatics 13-
3 Breakfall 13-
0 English (native)
2 KS: Aikido & Judo 11-
5 KS: History 14-
3 Mechanics 11-
3 PS: Assorted Sports 13-
5 SC: Aerodynamics 14-
5 SC: Astronautical Engineering 14-
5 SC: Mechanical Engineering 14-
3 Spanish (Completely Fluent)
4 Russian (Idomatic)
343 Total Powers & Skills Cost
460 Total Character Cost

100+ Disadvantages
10 Distinctive Features: Cyborg (EC, Maj)
10 Physical Limitation: One Eye (I, G)
Psychological Limitation:
15 Driven to prove himself (C, S)
10 Fears he's no longer human (C, M)
15 Secret ID: Operative for OSO
13 Watched: US Government/OSO (MopOw, NCI) 11-
287 Experience
460 Total Disadvantage Points

Designer's Notes:
Most people recognize the name 'Steve Austin' from the TV show "The Six
Million Dollar Man" (which starred Lee Majors in the title role). In
fact, the character was created for Martin Caidin's novel "Cyborg" which
first came out in 1972.

Caidin's Austin is pretty much the same character as the one in the TV
show. He is an astronaut, the youngest man to walk on the moon, and a
test pilot. While test flying the M3F5 lifting body, Austin looses
control of the vehicle while attempting to land and the plane cartwheels
across the desert floor, destroying itself and Austin at the same time.
In the process, Austin's legs are ruined, his left arm is severed, a
fragment blinds his left eye and... well, you get the idea. Interestingly
enough, the footage used in the TV show is of an actual crash of a NASA
experimental lifting body (the M2F3 I think), which also smeared itself
all over the desert during an attempted landing. The major difference was
that in this crash, the pilot was able to walk away with minor injuries
(the crash also led to a redesign of the control surfaces, namely the
vertical stabilizers).

Due to the extent of his injuries and Austin's rather unique status
(single, little family, very health and physically fit), Austin was
brought to a highly secret bionics/cybernetics research facility in order
to undergo an experimental procedure to replace his missing limbs with
cybernetic implants. In effect, Austin was to become the first fictional
cyborg (that I know of) as well as the first 'street samurai'.

Following a period of readjustment and training with his new limbs, Austin
was made a part of the Office of Special Operations (ie OSO) under the
direction of Oscar Goldman. OSO then made Austin into a special
operative, outfitting him with specialized equipment and cybernetics in
order for him to complete his current mission. Two such missions are
described in the book. One is to gain photographic evidence of a secret
Russian sub pen in South America, the other is to fly a MiG-27 out of
Egypt and into Israel.

Description:
A good description of Steve Austin is as follows: "... the youngest of the
astronauts ... who stood six feet, one inch tall, with eyes deep blue; a
lean, muscled frame, almost rangy; a laugh filled with warmth; and an
animal attraction about him." Interestingly enough, Lee Majors does fit
the description pretty well.

Powers Notes:
Steve Austin is, simply put, a wunderkind. Even before the accident and
his reconstruction, he was a remarkable athlete, with black belts in akido
and judo. He wrestled, fenced, boxed, participated in various sports and
practiced acrobatics. He flew combat choppers for the Army in Vietnam,
and joined the Air Force in order to get into the space program. He has
five degrees, including a masters in aerodynamics, astronautical
engineering and history. He also speaks (at least) Spanish and Russian.

Austin's bionics are very much the work of science fiction. They are very
strong, run of tiny nuclear batteries, durable and capable of allowing
Austin to greatly exceed the human normal. His left arm has 10 times the
gripping and crushing strength of his original limb. His legs can propel
him at a steady 5.3 mph *forever*, at once put in motion can (and do) keep
moving regardless of his mental state. At one point, he walks out of a
desert, literally unconscious on his feet. Although he can feel pain in
his limbs, it is greatly reduced. A small dart gun is built into the
middle finger of his left hand. It fires tiny darts that dissolve on
impact with the skin and will take effect in 6 seconds (and will kill
*very* quickly). Although the dart gun is not a 'no range' weapon, it
certainly doesn't have the full range that you would normally get from a
4d6 RKA. I'd guess a maximum range of about 15' with the dart gun.
Austin's left hand is also laced with steel strips, allowing him to punch
through a wooden door or thin sheet metal with ease. Naturally, he can
also kill someone with a single well directed blow to the head or neck.
His left eye is now a miniature camera, with 20 exposures. In his right
thigh is an air tank that will last for 30 minutes. Pop-out swim fins are
built into his feet and last (but not least) a radio has been built into
his body.

Due to his smaller body size, Austin's heart is now much more efficient.
It has less blood to oxygenate, meaning that it it tiakes less time for
the blood to get distributed through what is left of the body. Thus,
Austin can maintain a higher level of exertion for longer, and bounces
back from exhaustion quicker. He rebuilt body has also been reinforced
with various metals in his ribs and skull, making his body physically
tougher as well.

Disadvantages Notes:
Austin's cybernetics are concealed under a layer of artificial skin and
are not readily apparent. However, they could be detected in a number of
ways: by feel, x-ray scan, weight, density and so on. Unlike the TV Steve
Austin, Caidin's character has only one eye, meaning his depth perception
suffers quite a bit. He is also blind to his left side. Austin spends a
lot of time wondering if he is still a human. He won't go near women (for
example) and at times is afraid to touch people for fear of breaking them.
On the other hand, he is also driven to prove himself and feels he can
overcome his body's problems to once again be able to act as a 'normal'
human. Interesting enough, the character comes across as very strong
willed, with few debilitating psychological quirks.

(Colonel Steve Austin created by Martin Caidin, character sheet created by
Michael Surbrook, with help from Nestor Rodriguez.)

- --
Michael Surbrook - susano@otd.com - http://www.otd.com/~susano/index.html

If a woman has to choose between catching a fly ball and saving an
infant's life, she will choose to save the infant's life without even
considering if there is a man on base. - Dave Barry

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 18:39:57 +0200
From: Henrik Giese <henrik.giese@lgp.se>
Subject: RE: House Rules that become "real."

This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand
this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.

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At 04:45 PM 6/17/99 +0200, Henrik Giese wrote:
> Even tho' we finally noticed that we're wrong, we still play that
>using an attack doesn't end your phase. ie, attack on phase N (=BD =
phase)
>then again on phanse N+1 (rest of phase), if you attack twice in a =
phase,
>you get a -2 OCV. =20

Wow - that's a pretty extreme one. I would think this makes characters =
with
Desolidification nigh-unstoppable; it's pretty close to a free Affects
Desolid on all their attacks. Characters with high movement would be
similarly difficult to deal with. An extra attack doesn't mean all that
much, but the ability to attack then immediately launch a defense =
changes
combat dynamics a lot.

Can you give us any observations about how this affects your combats &
character construction?

Bill Svitavsky
**************************
Not very much, actually.
Instead of =BDmove/attack, =BDmove/defense or just stand still and =
attack/defend
you get:
=BDmove/attack, =BDmove/defense, attack/defend or attack/attack.
The most obvious thing is that OCV levels get a lot more important when =
most
opponents will be dodging continously. Speedsters and desolidifiers you =
hold
phases to engage.
I think we usually build our characters with slightly weaker defenses =
than
normal, but that's about it.

/Henrik

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<TITLE>RE: House Rules that become "real."</TITLE>
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At 04:45 PM 6/17/99 +0200, Henrik Giese wrote:
 >     Even tho' we finally =
noticed that we're wrong, we still play that
 >using an attack doesn't end your phase. ie, =
attack on phase N (=BD phase)
 >then again on phanse N+1 (rest of phase), if you =
attack twice in a phase,
 >you get a -2 OCV.  


Wow - that's a pretty extreme one. I would think this =
makes characters with
 Desolidification nigh-unstoppable; it's pretty close =
to a free Affects
 Desolid on all their attacks. Characters with high =
movement would be
 similarly difficult to deal with. An extra attack =
doesn't mean all that
 much, but the ability to attack then immediately =
launch a defense changes
 combat dynamics a lot.


Can you give us any observations about how this =
affects your combats &
 character construction?


Bill Svitavsky
 **************************
 Not very much, actually.
 Instead of =BDmove/attack, =BDmove/defense or just =
stand still and attack/defend you get:
 =BDmove/attack, =BDmove/defense, attack/defend or =
attack/attack.
 The most obvious thing is that OCV levels get a lot =
more important when most opponents will be dodging continously. =
Speedsters and desolidifiers you hold phases to engage.

I think we usually build our characters with slightly =
weaker defenses than normal, but that's about it.


/Henrik


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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 10:05:24 -0700 (PDT)
From: Stormtide <stormtide@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: dialects

- --- geoff heald <gheald@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
> At 04:45 PM 6/16/99 -0400, you wrote:
- ---[ Snipped]---
> >a fishhut is a little plywood structure you drag
> out onto a frozen lake to
> >sit in while you go ice fishing - not me, but some
> people do it
>
> I don't ice fish and where I live you can't muster
> enough ice to interfere
> with the fishing.
> How about the US regional dialects. For instance, a
> peice of livingroom
> furnature big enough to seat three. Do you call it
> a couch, sofa, or
> davenport?
>
>
> ============================
> Geoff Heald
> ============================

Although I have enjoyed reading these discussions
about regional dialects, I believe that this will
quickly go way off-topic for this list.

Rather than fill up the list with my particular
regional dialect, I suggest that you try out the
following links and have some fun with the
translators:

http://www.pittsburghese.com/
http://www.rinkworks.com/dialect/

_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 13:08:23 -0500
From: Bryant Berggren <voxel@theramp.net>
Subject: Re: CHAR: Colonel Steve Austin

At 12:15 PM 6/17/99 -0400, Michael Surbrook wrote:
>Designer's Notes:
>Most people recognize the name 'Steve Austin' from the TV show "The Six
>Million Dollar Man" (which starred Lee Majors in the title role). In
>fact, the character was created for Martin Caidin's novel "Cyborg" which
>first came out in 1972.

Of course, these days most people recognize "Steve Austin" as the WWF's cash
cow and t-shirt jockey. :] So turns the wheel ...

(While we're at it, of course, "Stephen Austin" was the founder of the Texas
Rangers.)

>Due to the extent of his injuries and Austin's rather unique status
>(single, little family, very health and physically fit), Austin was
>brought to a highly secret bionics/cybernetics research facility in order
>to undergo an experimental procedure to replace his missing limbs with
>cybernetic implants. In effect, Austin was to become the first fictional
>cyborg (that I know of) as well as the first 'street samurai'.

Well, in the scientific sense. There's always Nuada's silver hand if you're
willing to stretch.

> Although he can feel pain in his limbs, it is greatly reduced.

Hmm ... my memory of the novel(s) was that he doesn't actually feel pain,
but rather a tingling "fantasia" sensation (i.e. that his nervous system has
adapted a new response to signal what pain used to for his bionic parts). Of
course, this is probably functionally the same.

> He rebuilt body has also been reinforced with various metals in his ribs
> and skull, making his body physically tougher as well.

In the more cinematic version of the television series, one would want to
add Mental Defense -- the "cesium plate" in Austin's skull ostensibly blocks
telepathic transmissions (cf. that oddball Sasquatch storyline). (Of course,
doesn't cesium /melt/ at the temperature of a hot summer day?)

- --

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 14:09:20 -0400 (EDT)
From: Michael Surbrook <susano@dedaana.otd.com>
Subject: Re: CHAR: Colonel Steve Austin

On Thu, 17 Jun 1999, Bryant Berggren wrote:

> >Designer's Notes:
> >Most people recognize the name 'Steve Austin' from the TV show "The Six
> >Million Dollar Man" (which starred Lee Majors in the title role). In
> >fact, the character was created for Martin Caidin's novel "Cyborg" which
> >first came out in 1972.
>
> Of course, these days most people recognize "Steve Austin" as the WWF's cash
> cow and t-shirt jockey. :] So turns the wheel ...

Oh yeah... I forgot about him... (honest)

> (While we're at it, of course, "Stephen Austin" was the founder of the Texas
> Rangers.)

Didn't know that.

> >Due to the extent of his injuries and Austin's rather unique status
> >(single, little family, very health and physically fit), Austin was
> >brought to a highly secret bionics/cybernetics research facility in order
> >to undergo an experimental procedure to replace his missing limbs with
> >cybernetic implants. In effect, Austin was to become the first fictional
> >cyborg (that I know of) as well as the first 'street samurai'.
>
> Well, in the scientific sense. There's always Nuada's silver hand if you're
> willing to stretch.

Well, yeah there is that.

> > Although he can feel pain in his limbs, it is greatly reduced.
>
> Hmm ... my memory of the novel(s) was that he doesn't actually feel pain,
> but rather a tingling "fantasia" sensation (i.e. that his nervous system has
> adapted a new response to signal what pain used to for his bionic parts). Of
> course, this is probably functionally the same.

Probably. At one point he says his legs hurt, later he says it 'tingles'.
I will admit I wrote all of this in a single sitting and may have missed a
few minor details.

> > He rebuilt body has also been reinforced with various metals in his ribs
> > and skull, making his body physically tougher as well.
>
> In the more cinematic version of the television series, one would want to
> add Mental Defense -- the "cesium plate" in Austin's skull ostensibly blocks
> telepathic transmissions (cf. that oddball Sasquatch storyline). (Of course,
> doesn't cesium /melt/ at the temperature of a hot summer day?)

I can't answer that.

- --
Michael Surbrook - susano@otd.com - http://www.otd.com/~susano/index.html

If a woman has to choose between catching a fly ball and saving an
infant's life, she will choose to save the infant's life without even
considering if there is a man on base. - Dave Barry

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 14:27:43 -0400
From: Bill Svitavsky <nbymail11@mln.lib.ma.us>
Subject: Re: CHAR: Colonel Steve Austin

At 01:08 PM 6/17/99 -0500, Bryant Berggren wrote:
>At 12:15 PM 6/17/99 -0400, Michael Surbrook wrote:

>>Due to the extent of his injuries and Austin's rather unique status
>>(single, little family, very health and physically fit), Austin was
>>brought to a highly secret bionics/cybernetics research facility in order
>>to undergo an experimental procedure to replace his missing limbs with
>>cybernetic implants. In effect, Austin was to become the first fictional
>>cyborg (that I know of) as well as the first 'street samurai'.
>
>Well, in the scientific sense. There's always Nuada's silver hand if you're
>willing to stretch.
>

Similarly, there's Pelops' ivory shoulder in Greek myth.

Corwainer Smith's scanners in "Scanners Live in Vain" come to mind as early
cyborgs. They're astronauts who've been altered to survive the hardships of
space travel; no prosthetic limbs, but rather direct mechanical control of
body functions and sensitivity. This very cool story was written in the
1950's, I believe.

The comic book hero Robotman had an organic brain in a robot body; he was
created in 1942 by Jerry Siegel (co-creator of Superman). His humanity was
an issue, too; a classic story featured "The Trial of Robotman", where the
mechanical man made a case for his human rights.

The Oxford English Dictionary, by the way, cites the term "cyborg" as early
as 1960. Steve Austin was certainly a pivotal character in popular
awareness of cyborgs, though.

Bill Svitavsky

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 11:21:39 -0700 (PDT)
From: shaw@caprica.com (Wayne Shaw)
Subject: Re: Darkness (Was RE: Teleport & the Area Effect Advantage)

>
>>Not to mention that a 200" UAO Teleport (which can, indeed, be used whether
>>the target likes it or not...that's the whole point of the distinction
>>between UAO and UBO) would cost, hmmm, about 800 character points.
>
>You don't need that many points:
>
>Teleport 10", UAO, AOE 1 hex, Continuous (70 Active): The teleport
>transports you one hex above the affected hex.
>
>Turn this on someone, let them fall until they are at terminal velocity,
>turn it off.
>
>I named the character I gave this to Splat. :)
>
>Geoff Speare (no, never actually used the character...)

Of course, you can do a lot of that with a much cheaper TK..

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 11:50:05 -0700
From: Bob Greenwade <bob.greenwade@klock.com>
Subject: Re: dialects

At 08:27 AM 6/17/1999 -0700, Ben Brown wrote:
>On Thu, 17 Jun 1999, S A Rudy wrote:
>
>> I was in my high school's marching band. We held the cheerleaders largely
>> in contempt. (Of course, this may have had something to do with the fact
>> that, due to the socioeconomic dynamic of the school, we were a
>> significantly higher quality band than they were a cheerleading squad.)
>>
>
>I don't think it's a quality thing, although that certainly exacerbates
>the contempt. I've never met a high school marching band that didn't hold
>the cheerleaders in contempt. It largely stems from the feeling that no
>matter how good the band is, they're always going to be sort of an
>afterthought, while cheerleaders are percieved as being part and parcel
>with the "popular crowd".

Very strange.... the general band vs cheerleader attitude where I
played in the marching/pep band was that we had a symbiotic relationship.
The pep band even played a few tunes for the drill team, voluntarily....
But anyway, I think we're drifting pretty far afield here. Tips on
regional dialects is one thing; it helps to accurately portray a character
from the region in question. This is a bit "out there," though.
- ---
Bob's Original Hero Stuff Page! [Circle of HEROS member]
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/original.htm
Merry-Go-Round Webring -- wanna join?
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/merrhome.htm
Interested in sarrusophones? Join the Sarrusophone Mailing List!
http://www.klock.com/public/users/bob.greenwade/sarrus.htm

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 11:30:26 -0700 (PDT)
From: shaw@caprica.com (Wayne Shaw)
Subject: Re: Draining Innate abilities

>--- David Nasset <dnasset@cns.eds.com> wrote:
>> >From: Joe Mucchiello [SMTP:jmucchiello@yahoo.com]
>> >I disagree with this completely. You should always avoid Transform
>> >where something else exists to do it.
>>
>> Good rule of thumb, bad rule. Using this rule, many horrendously
>> abusive powers using UAO would be the right way to go, rather than a
>> reasonably priced Transform.
>
>I don't see how the amount of BODY something has should affect how well
>it is Drained. Transform is a silly mechanic for making a ghost solid.
>

Whyso? It turns something (an insubstantial being) into something else (a
substantial being). That sounds a lot like a transformation to me.

>I don't understand why you think the catch-all /
>I-can't-figure-out-a-better-way mechanic is not horrendously abusive.

Well, among other things, it's got a standard defense, and requires either a
reasonable investment of points or multiple hits to do the job. It's much
better 'metered' than UAO.

>I prefer UAO powers. I don't think they are that abusive. I also like
>the Usable On Other rules from HA1. Your reasonable priced Transform
>is a hack. Why not make the result of the Transform an anvil. If you
>are going to use enough power to kill your victim just to make him
>shorter/taller/solider, wouldn't you have been better served by killing
>him?

Depends on what your purpose was in making him solid.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 14:31:15 -0500
From: Bryant Berggren <voxel@theramp.net>
Subject: Re: House Rules that become "real."

At 12:22 AM 6/17/99 -0500, J. Alan Easley wrote:
> Anybody out there ever run into a similar situation in your Champions
> games? I have occasionally but I find out it usually is based on a rule
> from an earlier game edition. We started with first edition and kept
> up-to-date and played all of the editions since. I am usually the one to
> notice because I stopped playing with this group during second edition
> and joined back up after they had moved on to fourth and personally
> never played third.

I'm not sure I remember any Champions examples of intentional home rules
becoming "real", though I've seen a lot of games where an honest mistake
propogates into "real" rules because nobody ever bothers looking things up
(not that I advocate daily scripture readings from the BBB or something :] ...).

The first group I gamed with (HERO-wise) ignored the rules letting you apply
non-resistant defenses against STUN from KAs. It made for some truly brutal
(and short) fights ... and apparently came entirely from no one having read
the one page where that rule exists.

Another game routinely handed out Everyman skills as "real" points (i.e.
buying Deduction only cost 2 points, because you had 1 point Everyman).

> I once played in a AD&D game, in which the GM let any Cleric throw any
> spell in the book on-the-fly. This meant that as a Magic-User I had to
> pick my spells before beginning the adventure and could only use what
> I had picked, a Cleric could wait until combat began and pick the most
> advantageous spell at that moment from the entire Player's Handbook and
> even several spells from other sources like the Tome of Mighty Magic,
> not the one by TSR the old one from a local publisher hereabouts. It
> didn't really adversely affect the game as much as it might seem. A few
> other unimportant adjustments and we rebalanced the game.

Our current AD&D-redux (I always wonder if rewriting AD&D "home rules" until
you get something that barely resembles AD&D isn't like a roleplayer's
version of building your own lightsabre ...) ends up with both mages and
clerics picking spells "on the fly"; clerics are limited by the deities'
ability to say "no" (adapted from the NPC reaction tables) and magic-users
are limited by "fuzzy memory". Not that this has anything to do with the
topic, I just note that *I* may be in danger of "virtual rule-ality" in the
indefinite future. :]

==

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 13:20:00 -0700 (PDT)
From: Oscar Tibor <oscartibor@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: The Metric System

- --- Brian Wawrow <bwawrow@fmco.com> wrote:
<snip>
> Now, who knows what a hectare is?
>
> BRI

The question should be:

Who gives a flying leap on a rolling donut as to what a hectare is?

Most of us gringos don't really care about the metric system. Those
few American states that switched to metric have quietly dumped it in
favor of our "quaint" or "archaic" system of measurements. Only our
military uses the metric system as a rule. Everyone else kinda sorta
uses it whenever we have to, but we truly like our system better.

It is true the metric system makes oodles upon oodles of common sense,
however it is also extremely boring.

We yanks absolutely love and adore having to do complicated
calculations to determine if a pint is half a quart or 2/3 a pound or
maybe even half a yard.

It's been pouring here in Tampa for the last 2 weeks. I've almost
decided to go down to the lumber yard to buy a few hundred board feet
for Oscar's Patented Floating Dumpster. I'll either sail to safety in
it or sell it to the US Navy for $42.8 million.

Well I've got my flame proof galoshes on.
===
Oscar Tibor
Florida Insurance Agent Extraordinaire
_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 15:18:33 -0500 (CDT)
From: "Dr. Nuncheon" <jeffj@io.com>
Subject: [WOT] Band Stuff (was Re: dialects)

On Thu, 17 Jun 1999, Bob Greenwade wrote:
> At 08:27 AM 6/17/1999 -0700, Ben Brown wrote:
> >On Thu, 17 Jun 1999, S A Rudy wrote:
> >
> >> I was in my high school's marching band. We held the cheerleaders largely
> >> in contempt. (Of course, this may have had something to do with the fact
> >> that, due to the socioeconomic dynamic of the school, we were a
> >> significantly higher quality band than they were a cheerleading squad.)
> >
> >I don't think it's a quality thing, although that certainly exacerbates
> >the contempt. I've never met a high school marching band that didn't hold
> >the cheerleaders in contempt. It largely stems from the feeling that no
> >matter how good the band is, they're always going to be sort of an
> >afterthought, while cheerleaders are percieved as being part and parcel
> >with the "popular crowd".
>
> Very strange.... the general band vs cheerleader attitude where I
> played in the marching/pep band was that we had a symbiotic relationship.
> The pep band even played a few tunes for the drill team, voluntarily....

In my HS, the marching band had a dance drill team and a color guard (flag
squad) that performed with it. The cheerleaders were a separate entity,
and they didn't get along much with the band - which had the same quality
scenario as S A Rudy's did.

J

Hostes aliengeni me abduxerent. Jeff Johnston - jeffj@io.com
Qui annus est? http://www.io.com/~jeffj

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 14:26:00 -0400
From: David Nasset <dnasset@cns.eds.com>
Subject: RE: Clarifying a point(attn:HERO)

From: geoff heald [SMTP:gheald@worldnet.att.net]

>
>Throughout the HSR, "opponent" is used interchangably with "target".
I'm
>not the only one who feels this was not meant to mean that your
"opponent"
>could not be yourself, but the term is not in the HSR glossary. Could
Hero
>Games please define "opponent" for us?

Well, if it isn't interchangeable with "target", then you cannot throw a
net over yourself (Entangle is used on 'opponents'), you cannot shine
bright lights in your eyes (Flash is used on 'opponents'). Both seem
rather odd; if this is the ruling, then that would define my first house
rule in the new edition right there.

David Nasset, Sr.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 14:49:00 -0400
From: David Nasset <dnasset@cns.eds.com>
Subject: RE: The Metric System [was...Space Battleship]

From: Brian Wawrow [SMTP:bwawrow@fmco.com]
>] I'm surprised by how many Americans had to point that out. US
>] is correct in
>] the US, but U.S.A is correct everywhere else, especially in
>] countries named
>] United States of Something Else.
>Yea, but everybody knows who the Americans are. I may live on one of
two
>American continents but I'm no American.

Everybody, except those south of the USA/Mexico border. Some people
south of that border get offended when we call ourselves "Americans".

Its beginning to look like we'll have to go with USA and Usans to keep
everyone happy.:)

Filksinger

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 17 Jun 1999 15:39:46 PDT
From: Jesse Thomas <haerandir@hotmail.com>
Subject: If we aren't Americans, what are we? (Was: Metric System)

On Thu, 17 Jun 1999 David Nasset <dnasset@cns.eds.com> wrote:

>Its beginning to look like we'll have to go with USA and Usans to keep
>everyone happy.:)

Never happen. Personally, I think we should just accept it and start
calling ourselves 'gringos', the way Oscar did earlier. It wouldn't be the
first time a group has taken a pejorative term and converted it into a badge
of pride. Of course, we gringos aren't exactly a persecuted minority, but I
think the principle should hold...

Jesse Thomas

haerandir@hotmail.com

_______________________________________________________________
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------------------------------

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