Digest Archives Vol 1 Issue 67
Desmarais, John
From: owner-champ-l-digest@sysabend.org
Sent: Friday, December 04, 1998 1:18 PM
To: champ-l-digest@sysabend.org
Subject: champ-l-digest V1 #67
champ-l-digest Friday, December 4 1998 Volume 01 : Number 067
In this issue:
Re: Article on Canada (fwd)
Re: Independent Limitation
Re: NEED IDEAS: FUN WITH NAZIS
some dumb questions for the list.
Re: NEED IDEAS: FUN WITH NAZIS
Re: Independent Limitation
Re: Independent Limitation
Re: Independent Limitation
Re: Independent Limitation
Re: Independent Limitation
Re: Independent Limitation
Re: Independent Limitation
Re: squeezing damage
Re: Unfinished Power Set!
Re: squeezing damage
Re: The Canadian Shield
Re: Independent Limitation
Re: The Canadian Shield
RE: NEED IDEAS: FUN WITH NAZIS
Test
RE: Article on Canada (fwd)
Re: Independent Limitation
Re: NEED IDEAS: FUN WITH NAZIS
Re: Independent Limitation
Re: NEED IDEAS: FUN WITH NAZIS
Re: Test
Re: Independent Limitation
Re: Independent Limitation
Re: Independent Limitation
Re: Fun w/Nazis
Re: Independent Limitation
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 17:21:44 +1000
From: "Lockie" <jonesl@cqnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: Article on Canada (fwd)
- -----Original Message-----
From: Filksinger <filkhero@usa.net>
To: Champions Mailing List <champ-l@sysabend.org>
Date: Friday, December 04, 1998 7:35 AM
Subject: Re: Article on Canada (fwd)
>From: Michael Surbrook <susano@otd.com>
><snip>
> Not too shabby for a nation that just 240 years ago had no
>electricity.
>
>
>Wow. A country with no lightning.
>
>Filksinger
>
>
please, they prefer 'weather impared'. .
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 17:25:12 +1000
From: "Lockie" <jonesl@cqnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: Independent Limitation
um, iron man? the guy who took the hulk down with one punch? Oh no, not
tough at all. . . .
- -----Original Message-----
From: James Jandebeur <james@javaman.to>
To: Bryant Durrell <durrell@innocence.com&> champ-l@sysabend.org
<champ-l@sysabend.org>
Date: Friday, December 04, 1998 9:07 AM
Subject: Re: Independent Limitation
>>Nah, he's saving up points from all his adventures. He's been around
>>how many years now? If he has an average GM, he's sure to have a
>>*ton* of points and he can't have spent them all or he'd be defeating
>>Galactus single-handedly...
>
>
>Heh. Well, there is that. "Watch out, Tribunal, I'm the INVINCIBLE Iron
Man!
>And I MEAN that!"
>
>JAJ, GP
>
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 17:26:13 +1000
From: "Lockie" <jonesl@cqnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: NEED IDEAS: FUN WITH NAZIS
- -----Original Message-----
From: Filksinger <filkhero@usa.net>
To: champ-l@sysabend.org <champ-l@sysabend.org>
Date: Friday, December 04, 1998 9:32 AM
Subject: Re: NEED IDEAS: FUN WITH NAZIS
>From: Ell Egyptoid <egyptoid@yahoo.com>
>
>
>>Definitely use a Zeppelin, but: Don't fill the Zeppelin with
>>hydrogen, use helium, sure its more expensive, but its worth it.
>>Remember: good zeppelins have compartmentalized envelopes and
>>can't be "popped" with one shot. Also the Nazis will have a supply
>>of patch kits.
>
>
>Alternately, _do_ fill it with hydrogen. Have it blow up. Have the heroes
>cheer. Then, when they turn around, they discover the SS, weapons leveled,
>grinning at them.
>
>Filksinger
>
and then the french resistance turns up.
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 18:30:03 +1000
From: "Lockie" <jonesl@cqnet.com.au>
Subject: some dumb questions for the list.
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
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I'm pulling together a character, and a have a few questions:
*if one was trying to blanket a whole planet in AE hexes, would =
'AE-radius'
be aplicable sor covering the surface, or should 'AE-any' be used, to =
depict the complex and varied nature of a planets surface, underworld, =
ect? In all cases, what's the circumference of the earth in hexes? (hey =
my atlas is upstairs, ok?)
*does the list think a continuous power can be 'set off' multiple times=20
if previous uses are still active?=20
*what happens to the points from a drain or transfer in the long term? =
if such a power is bought with scads (and i mean SCADS) of moves down =
the time chart, should the point still be reasonably use-able, for =
instance once the victim has dies and turned to dust?
That's all for now.=20
"Enslave humanity willya?"
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>
<META content=3Dtext/html;charset=3Diso-8859-1 =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D'"MSHTML 4.72.3110.7"' name=3DGENERATOR>
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<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>I'm pulling together a character, =
and a have a=20
few questions:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>*if one was trying to blanket a whole planet in AE =
hexes,=20
would 'AE-radius'</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>be aplicable sor covering the surface, or should =
'AE-any' be=20
used, to depict the complex and varied nature of a planets surface, =
underworld,=20
ect? In all cases, what's the circumference of the earth in hexes? (hey =
my atlas=20
is upstairs, ok?)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>*does the list think a continuous =
power can be=20
'set off' multiple times </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2></FONT><FONT size=3D2>if previous =
uses are still=20
active? </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>*what happens to the points from a drain or transfer =
in the=20
long term? if such a power is bought with scads (and i mean SCADS) of =
moves down=20
the time chart, should the point still be reasonably use-able, for =
instance once=20
the victim has dies and turned to dust?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>That's all for now. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>"Enslave humanity=20
willya?"</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>
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------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 04:46:40 -0600
From: "J. Alan Easley" <alaneasley@email.com>
Subject: Re: NEED IDEAS: FUN WITH NAZIS
- ----- Original Message -----
From: Lockie <jonesl@cqnet.com.au>
To: <champ-l@sysabend.org>
Sent: Friday, December 04, 1998 1:26 AM
Subject: Re: NEED IDEAS: FUN WITH NAZIS
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Filksinger <filkhero@usa.net>
>To: champ-l@sysabend.org <champ-l@sysabend.org>
>Date: Friday, December 04, 1998 9:32 AM
>Subject: Re: NEED IDEAS: FUN WITH NAZIS
>
>
>>From: Ell Egyptoid <egyptoid@yahoo.com>
>>
>>
>>>Definitely use a Zeppelin, but: Don't fill the Zeppelin with
>>>hydrogen, use helium, sure its more expensive, but its worth it.
>>>Remember: good zeppelins have compartmentalized envelopes and
>>>can't be "popped" with one shot. Also the Nazis will have a supply
>>>of patch kits.
>>
>>
>>Alternately, _do_ fill it with hydrogen. Have it blow up. Have the heroes
>>cheer. Then, when they turn around, they discover the SS, weapons leveled,
>>grinning at them.
>>
>>Filksinger
>>
>
>and then the french resistance turns up.
"Please listen carefully, I shall say this only once...."
Alan
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 04:15:09 -0600
From: "J. Alan Easley" <alaneasley@email.com>
Subject: Re: Independent Limitation
- ----- Original Message -----
From: Wayne Shaw <shaw@caprica.com>
To: <champ-l@sysabend.org>
Sent: Thursday, December 03, 1998 12:50 PM
Subject: Re: Independent Limitation
>
>> I have to go along with Guy here. Just because something *can* happen,
>>doesn't mean that it *must* happen.
>> My own tendency would be to let the character have the Independent
Focus
>>for a while, then take it away for a period, and then have an opportunity
>>to get it back. It would be during the absent period that the Limitation
>>of its being Independent would be underscored; a normal Focus could be
>
>But how is this different from an Indestructible focus, which also can't be
>replaced except by getting the original back? This is the problem, it
looks
>like some people are proposing giving an extra -2 Limitation for situations
>that would occur with one of the two standard kind of Foci without
Independent.
Unbreakable Foci, not only can be gotten back, they will be. If not a
similar item will be made accessible, as per description of Unbreakable
Foci. You can play it different but that is modifying/making a house rule.
Alan
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 04:19:33 -0600
From: "J. Alan Easley" <alaneasley@email.com>
Subject: Re: Independent Limitation
- ----- Original Message -----
From: Wayne Shaw <shaw@caprica.com>
To: <champ-l@sysabend.org>
Sent: Thursday, December 03, 1998 12:34 PM
Subject: Re: Independent Limitation
>
>>I usually don't allow Independant in superhero games, because:
>>1) I hate taking powers away from players permanently
>>2) Players hate it when you take away their powers permanently, even if
>> they asked for it by taking Independant.
>>
>>So, to avoid bad feelings, I avoid Independant.
>
>This is what I meant about Gold Kryptonite. For those who are two young,
>Gold Kryptonite used to be a variety of kryptonite that could permanantly
>take superpowers away from a Kryptonian. The problem with it as a
>limitation is that it's either nothing more than a boogyman (i.e. you're
>never going to actually use it on the player) or it cripples the character
>indefinitely. That's always seemed very problematic to me.
Gold Kryptonite was used against Superman several times. He didn't take
actions which would have exposed him to its effects. In other words, he
altered his normal actions to prevent himself from being exposed and
stripped of his powers.
Alan
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 04:09:06 -0600
From: "J. Alan Easley" <alaneasley@email.com>
Subject: Re: Independent Limitation
- ----- Original Message -----
From: James Jandebeur <james@javaman.to>
To: <champs-l@sysabend.org>
Sent: Thursday, December 03, 1998 11:36 PM
Subject: Re: Independent Limitation
>Please see my other post, as well.
>
>> Well, first of all, the rulebook makes no mention of an Irreplaceable
>> Focus (at least, not in my copy).
>
>It is called Unbreakable. Sorry. Which means that it is unique and
>irreplacable.
No it doesn't mean that. The description of Focus specifically states that
the GM must allow for a way to get an Unbreakable Focus remade if it is ever
broken. So, not only is an Unbreakable Focus not irreplacable it isn't even
unbreakable.
>Nowhere does the book say that points cannot be reduced by the GM for an
>adventure. If the GM is going to reduce your points long term but
>temporarily, he can do so. What you are describing is a temporary
>reduction of points as an adventure seed. This in no way requires
>Independent to pull off, so Independent is not necessary.
I had a GM once who liked to reduce the powers of characters for his
sadistic plots. He hasn't been seen for many years except on cold windy
nights, when the moon is full.
The above sounds to me more like a long-term Drain or a Gradual Effect(?)
Suppress.
I am firmly in the camp that doesn't go for GM fiat if it can be avoided.
Alan
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 03:54:11 -0600
From: "J. Alan Easley" <alaneasley@email.com>
Subject: Re: Independent Limitation
- ----- Original Message -----
From: James Jandebeur <james@javaman.to>
To: HERO System List <champ-l@sysabend.org>
Sent: Friday, December 04, 1998 12:06 AM
Subject: Re: Independent Limitation
>> the decision is the GM's). Even if you do insist on using the rule from
the
>> Dispel description as the removal method just how many balanced games are
>> going to have someone walking around with a Dispel that is powerful
enough
>> to overcome the TOTAL active points in a character?
>
>Well, you wouldn't have to overcome the active points of the character,
>only the active points of the Independent power. I would think. Yes, you
>do have to do that with a magic item: all the powers in it are
>Independent, though.
You seem to be assuming that all of the powers in an item that contains an
Independent power must be Independent. That may be true some of the time
but not necessarily always true. A magic amulet, for instance, could be
built with some points that if the sorcerer lost it would be lost to him
until when or if he retrieves that item. That same magic amulet could also
be used to focus spells that are not Independent. Powers that if the amulet
was stolen or destroyed could be still be used once a suitable focus was
found or made at no additional cost to the character.
> The dispel wouldn't destroy a place: merely remove the magic
>from it.
The description of Independent says otherwise. Do you not agree with it or
not know it?
Alan
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 04:40:22 -0600
From: "J. Alan Easley" <alaneasley@email.com>
Subject: Re: Independent Limitation
- ----- Original Message -----
From: James Jandebeur <james@javaman.to>
To: <champs-l@sysabend.org>
Sent: Friday, December 04, 1998 12:26 AM
Subject: Re: Independent Limitation
>This is the third time I have gotten this response, so I will address
>this issue specifically: there must be a chance for the character to be
>in the field. A real chance, otherwise it is not limiting at all. In a
>game that lasts long enough, those "chances" are going to cause the
>character to be in that field at some point.
Why not instead of a chance for the character to be in the field couldn't it
simply be an occasion where it would be extremely advantageous for the
character to be in the magnetic field but he is forced not to enter because
of his Limitation?
>Of course not: but that's not the way Secret ID is written. In the case
>of Independent, the only limitation is that the points are seperate from
>the character. For that to come up, a credible chance of loss must
>exist. With a chance for loss, you will lose it eventually.
Only if the chance is random does the last sentence hold true. There is a
chance that I will get divorced at some time in my life. That doesn't mean
that I ever will. It isn't a random uncontrollable chance. I am in control
of my actions and can and do choose not to. At times that means I act
differently than I might want to for a particular amount of time, middle of
arguments and such, but the chance is there. The
might-means-will-eventually argument is not logically sound unless
discussing a random chance for an infinite time period.
>Thanks to everyone for the help getting my opinion straightened out,
>JAJ, GP
You're welcome.
Alan
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 03:43:54 -0600
From: "J. Alan Easley" <alaneasley@email.com>
Subject: Re: Independent Limitation
- ----- Original Message -----
From: James Jandebeur <james@javaman.to>
To: HERO System List <champ-l@sysabend.org>
Sent: Thursday, December 03, 1998 11:54 PM
Subject: Re: Independent Limitation
>Ok: what Independent is is a way to disaco... dang, seperate the points
>involved from your character. The upshot of this is twofold: the item or
>power will be around whether you are, if you die it will still be there,
>it is permanent. This is a useful effect (some would argue that the
>Limitation is invalid because it is giving the power additional
>abilities, but nevermind). The other side of the coin is that you have
>the possibility of losing the power (item or otherwise).
Wouldn't those people be wrong? Other Limitations add good things too.
They simply take away more than they give.
>If willing to part with the points, this allows enchantment of areas,
>permanent spells on people (unless dispelled), the creation of very
>unique items, and so on. This is useful, if anyone is actually willing
>to do this (or if the GM is willing to provide some points for this
>purpose). Or buy those little items to make life more interesting,
>though some of these should really be awarded by the GM (hey if the
>players are willing to buy them, I'm willing to hand them out).
>
>However, in the specific case of a character in a supers game buying the
>powered armor in this way, it is inappropriate: this usage has the
>potential or even likelihood of ultimately crippling the character. It
>is rolling the dice with the character, and seeing if you make it
>through.
Wholeheartedly, agreed!
>> If attached to a place that it cannot be
>> Dispelled, that the place must be destroyed.
>
>I must still disagree on that point: I believe that this was an
>oversight while updating the rules. In the previous BBB, or previous
>books, they didn't have it on anything but foci, and it may be that they
>missed this point during the new edition.
This is what I still can't understand. I could accept that it is an
oversight, if it wasn't spelled out very clearly under the description of
Independent:
"A character could also throw an Independent Power on a person or on a
place. Casting an Independent Power on a location would attach the Power
permanently to that spot. The Power could only be removed if the location
itself is somehow destroyed. The possibilities are many: a holy ground, a
trap, a land of shadow, etc."
>Still, as a central part of your character conception, this is not
>something you would want, whether it could be dispelled or not. I don't
>think that it's particularly better to lose the points because someone
>dug up your ground over dispeling it. Still, it's currently the only way
>to get permanent effects. Which I suppose is better than losing a point
>of D&D Constitution.
>
>> If placed on/in a person that
>> you have to make up your own rule because the book doesn't specify.
Whether
>> or not that makes it worth a -2 is open to opinion because that varies
with
>> GMs use of the facts. But the above are facts and any changes of them
are
>> either skewed interpretations or house rules.
>
>This is a good argument toward allowing non-focused powers to be
>Dispelled: otherwise there is really no way to remove it from a person
>aside from killing them, at which point it no longer matters.
Sure you could allow that. As I have said, since the book doesn't specify
it makes sense to choose whatever you think is reasonable. My point is that
just because it makes sense and is reasonable doesn't mean that it isn't a
house rule. I would go so far as to say that it is actually a good example
of a house rule. i.e. sensable and reasonable to you maybe not to others.
The main problem I have with using Dispel to remove Independent powers from
a person is that it should be easier than that to remove them. Under the
description of Dispel it stipulates that the Dispel must overcome the total
active points in the item not just the independent ones. Before I would
allow an Independent power to be placed in a person, reasonable (to me) ways
to remove or disable that power would have to be defined.
Alan
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 06:57:48 -0500 (EST)
From: tdj723@webtv.net (thomas deja)
Subject: Re: Independent Limitation
- --WebTV-Mail-1989989891-81
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And the fact that Superman avoided being exposed to its energies and
being stripped of its powers made it a boogeyman.....
"'Remember, Boo-Boo...we only have one weakness."
"What's that, Rat Fink?"
"mmmmm.....Bullets."
--Rat Fink and Boo-Boo, RAT FINK A BOO BOO
____________________________________
THE ULTIMATE HULK, containing the new story, "A Quiet, Normal Life," is
available now from Byron Preiss and Berkley
_______________________________
An except from the new story "My Worst Break Up" can now be found at
MAKE UP YOUR OWN DAMN TITLE
www.freeyellow.com/members/tdj
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Reply-To: "J. Alan Easley" <alaneasley@email.com>
From: "J. Alan Easley" <alaneasley@email.com>
To: "HERO System List" <champ-l@sysabend.org&> "Wayne Shaw" <shaw@caprica.com>
Subject: Re: Independent Limitation
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 04:19:33 -0600
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- ----- Original Message -----
From: Wayne Shaw <shaw@caprica.com>
To: <champ-l@sysabend.org>
Sent: Thursday, December 03, 1998 12:34 PM
Subject: Re: Independent Limitation
>
>>I usually don't allow Independant in superhero games, because:
>>1) I hate taking powers away from players permanently
>>2) Players hate it when you take away their powers permanently, even if
>> they asked for it by taking Independant.
>>
>>So, to avoid bad feelings, I avoid Independant.
>
>This is what I meant about Gold Kryptonite. For those who are two young,
>Gold Kryptonite used to be a variety of kryptonite that could permanantly
>take superpowers away from a Kryptonian. The problem with it as a
>limitation is that it's either nothing more than a boogyman (i.e. you're
>never going to actually use it on the player) or it cripples the character
>indefinitely. That's always seemed very problematic to me.
Gold Kryptonite was used against Superman several times. He didn't take
actions which would have exposed him to its effects. In other words, he
altered his normal actions to prevent himself from being exposed and
stripped of his powers.
Alan
- --WebTV-Mail-1989989891-81--
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 04 Dec 1998 08:30:25 -0500
From: emiller1@worldbank.org
Subject: Re: squeezing damage
Even if you do not end up posting your armor rules to the list, I would
very much like to see them. Could you send me a copy? Thanks.
David
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 09:11:27 -0500 (EST)
From: Chris Hartjes <chris@ergmusic.com>
Subject: Re: Unfinished Power Set!
On 3 Dec, Filksinger wrote:
> From: Chris Hartjes <chris@ergmusic.com>
>
>
>
>>On 3 Dec, Jason Sullivan wrote:
>>> Here's an unfinished power set I'vebeen working on for the 'unstoppable
>>> super soldier.' He can resist pain and recover from the pain of injury
>>> rather quickly.
>>>
>>> +20 STUN, Only to aid in recoveries when unconcious (-1/2)
>>> Is this legal? And if so, in what order does it recover?
>>
>>I would just buy more REC. Not sure what that extra STUN would be good
>>for when unconcious...
>
>
> Actually, extra STUN will work, extra REC won't. When you are knocked out by
> a large enough attack, you recover once a minute or less. Thus, no matter
> how much REC you have, it takes at least that minimum time to recover, and
> it can get expensive.
Mental cramp. After I wrote it I pretty much figured out what the
intent of the power was.
?
>
>
> It means if you poisoned your blade and stab him, he gets poisoned, even if
> his armor stopped the attack with no damage. Also important if someone is
> trying to steal some of your blood for a vodoo rite.
Ahh.
>
> Uh, how do you buy extra dice without buying Presence?
>
Maybe I should have been more clear. He would get bonuses to his PRE
attack based on what he had done. The usual stuff like bonuses for
doing something unusual. I don't have the rule book memorized so I
can't remember the exact bonuses but I'm sure he'd get a few dice
rather easily.
Chris Hartjes
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 04 Dec 1998 08:30:25 -0500
From: emiller1@worldbank.org
Subject: Re: squeezing damage
Even if you do not end up posting your armor rules to the list, I would
very much like to see them. Could you send me a copy? Thanks.
David
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 08:04:58 -0600 (Central Standard Time)
From: Tim Gilberg <gilberg@ou.edu>
Subject: Re: The Canadian Shield
> > Tell me this is the inside joke I think it is? Did he originally
> >land in Calgary?
> >
> Um, not an inside joke, AFAIK. I'm from Ontario; I've never been out west,
> so I wouldn't know about any special attachment to that word. Rad's name
> will be explained in his character sheet. Suffice to say for now that it is
> an acronym.
Ahhh. OK. Well, if you've ever seen the movie Rad, set in such
an prototypically American town, well, it was shot it Calgary. I've been
reminded of this quite a bit from my friends living in Calgary.
-Tim Gilberg
-"English Majors of the World! Untie!"
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 04 Dec 1998 09:43:34 EST
From: llwatts@juno.com (Leah L Watts)
Subject: Re: Independent Limitation
>>(as an example of an Indpendent Power that was "not a Focus")
>>
>>>One of the examples given somewhere was basically an enchanted "tatoo"
or
>>>ritual scar that granted power to the possessor. It could be destroyed
by
>>>cutting the flesh, breaking the magical design.
>>
>>If wings are OAF, then tattoos are OIF.
>
>That's why wings are not considered OIF anymore. The rules for Foci
>specifically forbid Foci that require damage to a person to remove.
If they're feathered wings, they can be trimmed enough to prevent flight
without doing BODY -- I know someone who trims her birds' wings
regularly, and hasn't spilled any blood yet. I still wouldn't call
anything growing out of the character's back a focus, though.
Leah
___________________________________________________________________
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------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 07:19:14 -0800 (PST)
From: Ell Egyptoid <egyptoid@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: The Canadian Shield
yotta have a super-heroine called CANADIAN MIST.
sure, she can generate mist and fog (darkness, change env, etc.)
But her main power is putting bad guys under the influence and
pronto. She'd have like Transform: Person into Drunken Sot
or a combo of Dex, Int, and Ego drain. SFX: being blotto.
Her drunkeness powers can only be shut off by coffee, sleep, etc.
or having a Wolverine-style resistance to toxins.
==
Laissez le bon pim roulez! Elliott aka Egyptoid
_________________________________________________________
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------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 09:50:21 -0500
From: Brian Wawrow <bwawrow@mondello.toronto.fmco.com>
Subject: RE: NEED IDEAS: FUN WITH NAZIS
While looking for bizarre conspiracies to use in my FH campaign, I
stumbled across this website about the plot to kill Hiltler and stage a
coup during WWII. It's got loads of spooky Nazi stuff.
http://www.joric.com/Conspiracy/Tour.htm
] -----Original Message-----
] From: Filksinger [mailto:filkhero@usa.net]
] Sent: Thursday, December 03, 1998 3:45 PM
] To: champ-l@sysabend.org
] Subject: Re: NEED IDEAS: FUN WITH NAZIS
]
]
] From: Ell Egyptoid <egyptoid@yahoo.com>
]
]
] >Definitely use a Zeppelin, but: Don't fill the Zeppelin with
] >hydrogen, use helium, sure its more expensive, but its worth it.
] >Remember: good zeppelins have compartmentalized envelopes and
] >can't be "popped" with one shot. Also the Nazis will have a supply
] >of patch kits.
]
]
] Alternately, _do_ fill it with hydrogen. Have it blow up.
] Have the heroes
] cheer. Then, when they turn around, they discover the SS,
] weapons leveled,
] grinning at them.
]
] Filksinger
]
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 10:36:28 -0500 (EST)
From: Michael Surbrook <susano@otd.com>
Subject: Test
sent out at 10:36 EST.
Michael Surbrook / susano@otd.com
http://www.otd.com/~susano/index.html
"'Cause I'm the god of destruction, that's why!" - Susano Orbatos,Orion
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 10:38:16 -0500
From: Brian Wawrow <bwawrow@mondello.toronto.fmco.com>
Subject: RE: Article on Canada (fwd)
Weather Impared? The U.S. has probably 20 states that can't achieve a
proper state of winter. There's nothing impared about the weather up
here. We've got the strongest weather in the world.
Assault rifle impared maybe, but never weather impared.
How come those states are so tiny anyway?
BRI
]
] please, they prefer 'weather impared'. .
]
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 07:41:31 -0800 (PST)
From: Ell Egyptoid <egyptoid@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Independent Limitation
howzabout the concept of mana wells or ley lines?
I'd write it up as
30 666/33 End Reserve (Magic),recovery rate: per day,
ReqSklRoll,
Extra time,only to start power,
Indep,
Lim:must have the magician or priest perks,
Reduced by Rng,
Side FX Desc: CON drain if not manipulated correctly,
Difficult to Dispel x2,
Var SFX, any: Sorcery, Mana, Elemental
These things aren't tied to a place, they move around like jet streams
or can dry up like geysers. So it takes a skill roll to find one,
also it takes a phase to position yourself in it properly to
channel the power, you must be a magician or priest to use it,
(sorry mentalists), if you don't stand in it correctly, you lose
CON temporarily due to magic system shock, and it's independent.
So there's 666 points of END for you, which only rebuilds slowly,
but also means any skilled user can step into one and use "your"
power.
So there's an Indep power that's not a focus, or specific place.
You can find one anywhere, and anyone who can find it (Channeling
or Dowsing skill, etc) can also use it, even bad guys.
==
Laissez le bon pim roulez! Elliott aka Egyptoid
_________________________________________________________
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------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 09:41:16 -0600
From: "Guy Hoyle" <ghoyle1@airmail.net>
Subject: Re: NEED IDEAS: FUN WITH NAZIS
Wow, that's pretty spiffy! I'll have to take a good look at it. Thanks!
Guy
- ----------
> From: Brian Wawrow <bwawrow@mondello.toronto.fmco.com>
> To: champ-l@sysabend.org
> Subject: RE: NEED IDEAS: FUN WITH NAZIS
> Date: Friday, December 04, 1998 8:50 AM
>
> While looking for bizarre conspiracies to use in my FH campaign, I
> stumbled across this website about the plot to kill Hiltler and stage a
> coup during WWII. It's got loads of spooky Nazi stuff.
>
> http://www.joric.com/Conspiracy/Tour.htm
>
>
>
> ] -----Original Message-----
> ] From: Filksinger [mailto:filkhero@usa.net]
> ] Sent: Thursday, December 03, 1998 3:45 PM
> ] To: champ-l@sysabend.org
> ] Subject: Re: NEED IDEAS: FUN WITH NAZIS
> ]
> ]
> ] From: Ell Egyptoid <egyptoid@yahoo.com>
> ]
> ]
> ] >Definitely use a Zeppelin, but: Don't fill the Zeppelin with
> ] >hydrogen, use helium, sure its more expensive, but its worth it.
> ] >Remember: good zeppelins have compartmentalized envelopes and
> ] >can't be "popped" with one shot. Also the Nazis will have a supply
> ] >of patch kits.
> ]
> ]
> ] Alternately, _do_ fill it with hydrogen. Have it blow up.
> ] Have the heroes
> ] cheer. Then, when they turn around, they discover the SS,
> ] weapons leveled,
> ] grinning at them.
> ]
> ] Filksinger
> ]
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 08:58:57 -0800 (PST)
From: Ell Egyptoid <egyptoid@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Independent Limitation
>This is a useful effect (some would argue that the
>Limitation is invalid because it is giving the power additional
>abilities, but nevermind).
so what you're saying is when a power is independent,
it is LINKED to the environment? :)
==
Laissez le bon pim roulez! Elliott aka Egyptoid
_________________________________________________________
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------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 09:07:37 -0800 (PST)
From: Ell Egyptoid <egyptoid@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: NEED IDEAS: FUN WITH NAZIS
> > Alternately, _do_ fill it with hydrogen. blow it up. Have the heroes
> > cheer. Then they turn around, they discover the SS, weapons leveled,
> > grinning at them.
> and then the french resistance turns up.
and then the Rumanian Sympathizers show up with a patch kit, too late.
alternately, the zeppelin could be a "Death Star" scenario:
The Nazis have developed a new Zeppelin, somehow armored against
conventional machine guns, and it's wreaking havoc in the airways.
but many spies gave their lives to reveal a weakness: there's this
exhaust port on the diesel engine, in which a well placed shot could
cause an overload...
==
Laissez le bon pim roulez! Elliott aka Egyptoid
_________________________________________________________
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Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 04 Dec 1998 11:35:37 -0500
From: Bill Svitavsky <nbymail11@mln.lib.ma.us>
Subject: Re: Test
At 10:36 AM 12/4/98 -0500, Michael Surbrook wrote:
>sent out at 10:36 EST.
>
>Michael Surbrook / susano@otd.com
>http://www.otd.com/~susano/index.html
>"'Cause I'm the god of destruction, that's why!" - Susano Orbatos,Orion
>
Test? Nobody told me there was going to be a test! How much of our grade
will it count for? Can we take it over if we do badly?
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 04 Dec 1998 08:41:15 -0800
From: James Jandebeur <james@javaman.to>
Subject: Re: Independent Limitation
> Unbreakable Foci, not only can be gotten back, they will be. If not a
> similar item will be made accessible, as per description of Unbreakable
> Foci. You can play it different but that is modifying/making a house rule.
And if you always get the Independent item back, it is the same thing.
If you can rely on getting it back, you don't modify your behavior.
That's what it sounds like people are describing: purposely avoiding, as
a GM (not talking about player precautions), taking the item away
permanently. Therefore, it would be worth no additional limitation. If
you always get it back, it is Unbreakable, not Independent. This has the
side benefit of letting you re-spend the points if ever you DON'T get it
back. But not immediately.
JAJ, GP
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 09:37:33 -0800
From: "James Jandebeur" <james@javaman.to>
Subject: Re: Independent Limitation
>so what you're saying is when a power is independent,
>it is LINKED to the environment? :)
I'd like to take this moment to give thanks that that the 5th Edition will
finally put an end to the Great Linked Debate. Apparently.
When it's actually out, and if it really does do so, I suggest open dancing
in the streets and celebration.
JAJ, GP
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 04 Dec 1998 08:44:56 -0800
From: James Jandebeur <james@javaman.to>
Subject: Re: Independent Limitation
> Gold Kryptonite was used against Superman several times. He didn't take
> actions which would have exposed him to its effects. In other words, he
> altered his normal actions to prevent himself from being exposed and
> stripped of his powers.
Then it's a Psych Lim, not a limitation on the powers or other disad. If
it is never going to really be used, and he just avoids it, it is not
worth the limitation on all of his powers. It might be another type of
Disad, though. Same thing with Independent: if you want the character to
behave a certain way, but are never going to lose the Focus, or if the
GM doesn't want to really have the chance of you losing it, take a Psych
Lim, not Independent.
That said, I can see it if you will be without it a lot of the time: it
is locked up in a safe 90% of the time, or it is taken from you and you
go on a year-long quest to get it back. Then it's worth a -2. But if you
get it back quickly, within a few games, it is not (unless you also lose
it very frequently).
JAJ, GP
------------------------------
Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 08:44:44 -0800 (PST)
From: Ell Egyptoid <egyptoid@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Fun w/Nazis
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Der Fuehrer's Face
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
When Der Fuehrer says, "We ist der master race"
We HEIL! HEIL! Right in Der Fuehrer's face
Not to love Der Fuehrer is a great disgrace
So we HEIL! HEIL! Right in Der Fuehrer's face
When Herr Goebbels says, "We own der world und space"
We HEIL! HEIL! Right in Herr Goering's face
When Herr Goering says they'll never bomb this place
We HEIL! HEIL! Right in Herr Goering's face
Are we not the supermen Aryan pure supermen
Ja we ist der supermen Super-duper supermen
Ist this Natzi land not good?
Would you leave it if you could?
Ja this Natzi land is good!
Vee would leave it if we could
We bring the world to order
Heil Hitler's world New Order
Everyone of foreign race will love Der Fuehrer's face
When we bring to der world disorder
When Der Fuehrer says, "We ist der master race"
We HEIL! HEIL! Right in Der Fuehrer's face
When Der Fuehrer says, "We ist der master race"
We HEIL! HEIL! Right in Der...Fuhrer's...face!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Alright dammit, i got the line wrong...there's the lyrics.
It fits the old adage: Tragedy plus Time equals Comedy.
from: http://www.geocities.com/SunsetStrip/4020/spikelyr.html
==
Laissez le bon pim roulez! Elliott aka Egyptoid
_________________________________________________________
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------------------------------
Date: Fri, 04 Dec 1998 08:37:57 -0800
From: James Jandebeur <james@javaman.to>
Subject: Re: Independent Limitation
> >Ok: what Independent is is a way to disaco... dang, seperate the points
> >involved from your character. The upshot of this is twofold: the item or
> >power will be around whether you are, if you die it will still be there,
> >it is permanent. This is a useful effect (some would argue that the
> >Limitation is invalid because it is giving the power additional
> >abilities, but nevermind). The other side of the coin is that you have
> >the possibility of losing the power (item or otherwise).
>
> Wouldn't those people be wrong? Other Limitations add good things too.
> They simply take away more than they give.
Only officially: they would be talking about an ideal version of the
rules, where limitations are entirely limiting and advantages are
entirely advantagous. That is not the reality of it, no, and I am not a
supporter of the idea myself.
> "A character could also throw an Independent Power on a person or on a
> place. Casting an Independent Power on a location would attach the Power
> permanently to that spot. The Power could only be removed if the location
> itself is somehow destroyed. The possibilities are many: a holy ground, a
> trap, a land of shadow, etc."
Trust me: it could be an oversight. Many versions of the game breed
that. It might also not be. I'm speculating, and still like Dispel being
able to work here. As they say, YMMV.
<Point about house rule snipped, since I just agreed with it.>
JAJ, GP
------------------------------
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